A power team is a group of professionals in BNI who work in non-competing, related fields and have developed relationships so they can refer customers to each other.

Here are ten questions you should ask potential members of your power team to strengthen your connections and make it easier to pass referrals.

1. How did you get started in your business?
2. What do you enjoy most about what you do?
3. What separates you and your company from the competition?
4. What advice would you give someone starting out in your business?
5. What are the coming trends in your business or industry?
6. What strategies have you found to be the most effective in promoting your business?
7. If there were anything about your business or industry you could change, what would that be?
8. What is the next big event coming up for you?
9. What’s your biggest challenge at the moment?
10. What type of customers are you looking for? How will I recognize a good prospect for you? What kind of situations are your prospects facing?

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcript of BNI Podcast Episode 237 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the net for networking downloadables. I am Priscilla Rice, and I am coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkeley, CA. I am joined on the phone today by the Founder and Chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner. Hello Ivan, and happy new year to you.

Ivan:
Thank you, Priscilla. I appreciate it.

Priscilla:
So you have something to share with us about power teams. What might that be?

Ivan:
I do. I think with the new year and the beginning of the new year around the world, it is a great topic to start the BNI year with. That’s power teams. Power teams can really make a difference in a BNI chapter in terms of the success of that chapter. We have found that several strong power teams tend to generate more business within the group.

A power team is a group of people that are in complimentary professions. They work with the same client but they don’t take business away from each other. Great examples of these are found in the real estate and wedding industries. A realtor, a mortgage broker, a building inspector, title agency, real estate attorney. All service clients looking to purchase property. Now, a wedding planner, a photographer, and a florist all cater to the bride to be. If these professionals form a power team, when one person in the team gets business, then he or she can refer the client to every other member in the team.

Now, many people have heard me talk about power teams and contact spheres. A contact sphere is like a concentric circle. The contact sphere is all of the professions that are symbiotic to you. They are compatible, noncompetitive professions. The power team is the group of people that you actually have the relationship with, So contact spheres are basically a list of professionals that you may have that are symbiotic to you. The power team is the list of professionals who you have a relationship with, you are in a referral relationship with them.

Successful members in BNI have the ability to select and cultivate those mutually beneficial relationships with high quality strategically important business categories. I think it’s an important core competency for success for many members in a BNI group. The question is how do you cultivate those relationships? It’s really important that you find out as much as possible about those referral partners so that you can send the the right kind of business.

In one of our podcasts, we talked about transaction versus relation. This podcast is all about how you go deeper in building the relationship with your power team. The referrals will come as sort of an outgrowth of that relationship. As you build the relationship, you want to help one another, you’re working with one another and you’re finding out about one another. The referrals will come, but first you have to build the relationship. So I am going to give 10 important questions that you should ask your power team partner as well as some tips for the full advantage of information you gain.

This comes from the book, Money on the Table that was co-written with Lee Abraham and I. Lee did a wonderful job of putting together a lot of great content and I contributed to the book with my content as well. From this, we have these ten questions. If you have a chance, take a look at the book, Money on the Table. These questions come from there. When you sit down with your power team partner, here are the questions that you ask:

1. How did you get started in your business? This is a great ice breaker question. Sometimes knowing what motivated your partner to get into their particular business enables you give stronger testimonials about him or her. For example, I met a chiropractor once who told me he had gotten into chiropractics because of the serious injuries he had and how he couldn’t get well until he started seeing a chiropractor. Chiropractic care got him into that industry. That was a very compelling story. If you didn’t know that you wouldn’t fully understand what a believer this guy was in the power of chiropractic care.

2. What do you enjoy most about what you do? Telling a power partner about what you love and why you love it in detail is really important in helping people understand how to refer one another. If you can understand where they are coming from or what they love about what they do, it is easier to refer them.

3. What separates you and your company from the competition? That’s a good one. Now you’re getting a little deeper after hitting those ice breakers. You’re looking for bullet points that can be told quickly and easily to the prospect to illustrate why you can be trusted to do a good job. So remember when you are asking these questions that you are getting this information. Why? So you can refer your power partner. You are getting this so you can refer them. The more you know about them, the easier it is to refer you.

4. What advice would you give someone starting out in your business? Asking for advice shows respect and it’s essential for building credibility, I think, with your networking partner on the road to driving to profitability in the VCP process.

5. What are the coming trends in your business or industry? This is a really good question because it enables you to find out things that maybe you didn’t know about that business. If your power team partner gives detailed information and strategies on how to profit from upcoming trends, you may learn something of value from your own business. Remember, you are in compatible professions. The things going on in their industry could help you or harm you in some way but knowing about it is very important.

6. What strategies have you found to be most effective in promoting your business? That’s a really important one because again, you are in symbiotic businesses. This question leads to brainstorming for each other’s businesses and stimulates the exchange of marketing and promotional ideas as well as business building in general.

7. If there were anything about your business or industry that you could change, what would that be? That’s a really interesting question because it gets people thinking, really thinking. This question in addition to building rapport allows your power team partner to discuss business freely and provides you with the opportunity to suggest solutions or at least gain a better understanding of what challenges that individual may have.

8. What is the next big event coming up for you? This question almost always results in referral opportunities if it is followed up correctly. It could be an event like a trade show, but it could be a holiday, a season that they often do or don’t do business in. Any of those things that I am talking about, what is coming up for you seasonally, or an event.

9. What is your biggest challenge at the moment? The answer will provide insight into your networking partner’s business and what is going on in their business life. It will help you understand him or her as a person as well as possibly uncovering some money on the table in terms of referral opportunities with that person.

10. The last question that you want to ask is: What type of customers are you looking for? How will I recognize a good prospect for you? What are some of the specific situations that your targeted prospects are experiencing? These are all related questions. There is really more than one question there, but in essence, it is the vivid picture that your networking partner paints about who and what they are looking for. The more they do that, the greater the probability of you recognizing their targeted prospects. They are all part and parcel. You’re basically trying to find out what the ideal customer is for your power partner.

If you sit down and have this kind of conversation- we’ve talked about the GAINS Exchange in another podcast. That’s a real good opener for the average person that you are doing a one to one with. But these questions, I think, are the go to questions for your first meeting with a power partner or potential power partner in a BNI chapter. I urge BNI members to print this out and take it to their BNI meetings and start talking about these to they can build the relationship. Remember, it’s not the transaction. It’s the relationship that gets to the business.

Priscilla:
Beautiful. I think those are great questions. The only thing I would add is that using someone’s services in some way or another really is revealing and you get firsthand experience of what they are like to be worked with or receive something from. I find that to be really useful.

Ivan:
Yeah, that firsthand experience is important. You bring up a good one. The power partner may not have actually used the service at the point where they are having this conversation, but if they had, that is something that should be added to the equation. The good and bad. I think if you really have a power partner that you trust, you want to hear what went well and what could I have done better?

Priscilla:
Yeah, right. You could get feedback. Okay. Great.

Ivan:
That’s it for this week, Priscilla. Thank you very much.

Priscilla:
I hope this is a beautiful year for you, Ivan.

Ivan:
As well for you. I just want to say I appreciate all the work you have done over the years. You produce a great podcast, and I thank you. I look forward to another year.

Priscilla:
Okay great. Well, you are my favorite client.

Ivan:
And this is about relationships, not transaction. Remember that, Michael.

Priscilla:
Okay great. That is it for this week. I would just like to remind you listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the net for networking downloadables. Thank you so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice and we hope you will join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

A BNI member recently asked Dr. Misner how to promote second tier (outside) referrals, because the other members of his chapter weren’t likely to use his services directly.

The truth is that if you only focus on the referrals that  are sitting there in the room, you’re going to limit your success. The network beyond the network is what matters. Everyone needs the second tier referrals.

To get those referrals, you have to train members in how to refer you. Specific is terrific for “Your Business 101.” Pick topics for your 30-second pitch at the meeting each week, the way you would create a training curriculum. Bring photos, testimonials, brochures.

Think about how this applies to your business. Sit down and think of four topics, then break each of those four down into 2-3 sub-topics. Post your topics here—and use them at your meetings. You’ll get many more referrals.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcript of BNI Podcast Episode 221 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the net for networking downloadables. I am Priscilla Rice, and I am coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkeley, CA. I am joined on the phone today by the Founder and Chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner. Hello Ivan, how are you ?

Ivan:
I am doing great, Priscilla. I have an interesting topic, something that I haven’t really tackled on the podcast before. I had a BNI member that recently asked me a question. He said, “ I’m a travel agent. Most of the business owners in my group are challenged to take time away, to get away from their businesses. They don’t travel a lot.” The question was, “What can I do to promote 2nd tier referrals?” He asked if I had any suggestions.

We use that term a lot on BNI. Not every group may have heard that term, 2nd tier, but it’s basically an outside referral. How do I get them to refer somebody else because they are not going to be using me directly a lot because they don’t travel.

Here is the short answer. The short answer is you have to create a Your Business 101 strategy. Your Business 101. Let me get to that by first saying that if all you do is focus on tier 1 referrals, you are really going to limit your business opportunities. If all you focus on are the referrals which are sitting there in the room- don’t get me wrong. It’s good to have people that you can do business with in the room because if they used you, then it’s easier to refer. But I think a lot of people either don’t join or they focus- they don’t join because “this isn’t enough people and I can’t get enough referrals from this” or “ I can’t get enough referrals from this.” Or they join and they just try to use the members in the room.

That’s never enough. You have to go way beyond and network beyond the network that is in the room. Now, the members know 100 people who know 100 people who know 100 people. So you really want to try to focus on that 2nd tier referral, that outside referral, all the time. Not just because you are in a certain business, but in virtually all businesses, if you want BNI to work, you have to go with the people that the members in the room know.

Knowing that, how do you get there? That is the real question. The answer is you create a curriculum for your business. You have to literally create a curriculum for your business. You have to train members how to refer you. So if you just say, “ I am a travel agent. I can take care of travel anywhere at anytime. If you need to have that, I can do that.” Nonsense. That is not enough.

That’s way too vague. You are never going to get any referrals off of that kind of a statement. You have to be really, really specific. Specific is terrific when you are thinking of Your Business 101.

Let me tell you a real quick story. I had a member who came up to me once and had his PDA in his hand, had a calendar on his mobile device and said, “ Pick a Wednesday, any Wednesday.” I said, “Why?” He said, “Pick a Wednesday. I want to show you something.” Wednesdays were the day his group met. I picked two months out. He said, “On that date, I’m talking about this topic.”

I said, “Well, that’s interesting. What else?” So he said to pick another Wednesday. I picked a Wednesday that was three or four months out. He said, “On that Wednesday, I am talking about this topic.” I said, “That’s interesting. How did you do it?” He said, “ You talk about being specific. What I did is I literally laid out a curriculum for the year week by week. This week I am going to talk about this topic. Next week, I am going to talk about that topic. I didn’t list what I was going to say, just that I am going to talk about this. Then I have a reminder on Tuesday that I am going to talk about X. Then I spend a couple of minutes figuring out what I am going to say the day before, but I have the curriculum lined up in advance.”

Now, let’s apply that to the travel agent. If you’re listening, I want you to apply that concept to Your Business 101. You are going to train somebody in your business.

You are a travel agent. What are the specifics you could talk about? Business travel. If you don’t do any business travel, obviously don’t talk about that, but if you do specialize in any kind of business travel, talk about that. Here is one way you could break it down into categories: Talk about vacation places. Talk about cruises. Cruises can actually be both business and vacation. I know a number of organizations that will do a business cruise, where you will have meetings during the day and then you are off on the ship on the evening. Talk about cruises. Talk about tours. Talk about local destinations.

This travel agent said the members don’t travel a lot. I bet you he has members in his chapter that might get away for a weekend. They might not take a whole week, although to be honest with you, I recommend that everybody always take vacation. I get people who say they haven’t had a vacation in five years. Okay, you’re crazy. You have to take vacations and recharge your batteries. I have always taken vacations my entire life. I work long crazy hours but vacations are important. Maybe just a little weekend trip. That’s fine.

So maybe talk about weekend destinations that I can book for you. Talk about exotic destinations. What you do then is say When you hear about somebody saying they want to go to Africa, here is what I know about Africa. Here is what I can do when you hear somebody say they want to take a trip to Africa.” Have information on all of these exotic destinations. Bring photographs. Bring testimonials. Bring brochures. Bottom line: Paint a picture in people’s minds that they can share with others. Talk about your experiences and other people’s experiences. Get laser specific each week. Travel agents is one of the coolest professions because each week could be a new destination, a whole different focus.

If you want to get outside referrals, get really specific about how people can refer you. That is the way to do it.

Priscilla:
I think that’s great. When you talked about a travel agent, I had the very same idea. Some of these travel agents get to go to the places that they are going to promote. You could come back with photos of the places they went and the fun they had. You only have a certain number of seconds to fill and we could just tantalize people week after week with the options.

Ivan:
You really can. Everybody can do this for their business. No matter what you business, you can break it down into small parts and talk about that each week. What I really want the members to do is literally create curriculum for your business. Your Business 101. You are going to do a little curriculum. I’m going to give you a little test here, Priscilla. I am going to ask you for two or three weeks of your curriculum.

Priscilla:
Right now?

Ivan:
Yes. In just a second. So you think about it for a second. For the listeners, this is completely off the cuff. I didn’t prepare her. This is how easy it is. Anybody can sit down and think of three or four things and then turn it into eight, ten and twelve so that you have a whole quarter of curriculum topics that you could could be talking about.

Priscilla, just off the cuff, could you give me two or three real specifics about what you do?

Priscilla:
The obvious one, I often talk about the podcast and what we have discussed here. Sometimes I will bring up the latest band that has recorded here and if we have been doing voice over work for an electronics company or video gaming. I constantly select different things that we do in the studio.

Ivan:
Alright let’s take those two or three. You talked about podcasts. One of the things you could do is not just talk about the general topic of podcasts, but maybe you have done podcasts with different markets. Something like BNI might be one podcast. A business coach who did podcasts with you or a corporation of some kind that is trying to get information out to their clients. There are different niches within podcasts. You don’t want to stand up and just talk about podcasts one week. You want to do the niche. Go deep. You might have three or four weeks worth of podcasts.

Then you talked about bands. Talk about the different types of bands. I know it sounds crazy and a lot of the members are wondering why be so specific? Be that specific because if you can say something that resonates with people, all of a sudden they pay attention.

Priscilla:
Yes, exactly. Then they are talking with their friends and somebody says something about a topic that you brought up and it rings a bell.

Ivan:
Exactly. So you can talk about two or three types of bands that you do over two or three weeks. “Last week, I talked about this band. Today, I want to talk about this band.” Now, what was the other one you did?

Priscilla:
We do voice overs and sound effects.

Ivan:
Voice overs- you could do weeks and weeks on voice overs. So what I want the listeners to do is right now, sit down and create four different topics. Then I want you to take those four topics and break those four down into two or three or four each and get 10 -12 weeks worth of topics. That’s your curriculum 101. By the way, this guy did it for 52 weeks. 52 topics. Okay, there were a couple of weeks that the chapter would be off for holidays. Roughly a year’s worth of topics he did.

Oh, and here is an important one. I said, “How has that worked out for you?” He said, “Since I started doing this, I get 3 or 4 times more referrals than I used to get because I get specific.”

Specific is terrific. Your Business 101. That is all I have for today, Priscilla.

Priscilla:
That’s excellent. Thank you for all of the good ideas, Ivan. I really appreciate it.

Ivan:
Thanks for letting me put you on the spot.

Priscilla:
Thank you all very much.. I would just like to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the net for networking downloadables. Thank you so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice and we hope you will join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

Today’s podcast is drawn from Networking Like a Pro, pages 155-164 (first printing).

The referral process is a system with feedback built into it. There are 8 steps.

1. Your source discovers a referral opportunity for you.
2. Research the referral. (Very few people do this, but it pays off.)
3. Check back in with your referral source to complete the research.
4. Meet with the referral.
5. Report back to your referral source on the outcome of the meeting.
6. Your source gets feedback from the referral. (This is priceless.)
7. Your referral source reports back to you.
8. You close the deal.

If every BNI group listened to this episode, the quantity and quality of referrals passed in the group will grow exponentially. Try it and report back in the comments.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcript of BNI Podcast Episode 212 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the net for networking downloadables. I am Priscilla Rice, and I am coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkeley, CA. I am joined on the phone today by the Founder and Chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner. Hello Ivan, how are you?

Ivan:
I am doing great, Priscilla. I am going to be talking about a topic that I think is really an important topic. Much of what I write about and do podcasts about in networking and referrals emphasizes the sometimes mysterious nature of referral marketing. In kind of a deep broad based mature referral network where you’re spending a lot of time doing good things for others, givers gain, and you’re not really looking for a direct reward, it seems maybe a little odd to describe the referral marketing process as a system, but it is a system. That’s what it is. Although it really is about giving business to others, it’s important to have a system in place and in mind and actions in place in order to generate those referrals and close deals.

What I wanted to do in this phone call is really drill down to members and talk about what I think is an eight step process. Now, you can make it less than this, but this is a sort of comprehensive overview of what I consider to be the whole process. You can find a lot of this material in the book that I did called Networking Like a Pro. It’s on pages 155 through 164 of Networking Like a Pro, the first printing. Check that out if you want to follow along with what I am talking about.

To begin with, what is a referral? It’s not as simple as we sometimes make it out to be. We leave college and go into business knowing little about referrals. We don’t teach it in school because referral marketing is rarely part of the curriculum. We know what a great thing it is to get a referral because it generally means a lucrative business without a lot of expense. We often think of it simply as the connection we can call on to do business with.

It’s really important to understand not only that referrals are the best kind of business but also how to make them happen when we want them to happen and when they come in, how to get the best results from them. The referral process is really a system that should, if it is done right, have a lot of feedback built into it. If you follow up on your referrals, you’ll be able to get some predictable results. There are eight steps that I want to give you now.

Step one begins with your source in discovering a referral. The referral begins with an event. It is kind of outside your direct involvement. Your referral source- in BNI it’s a fellow BNI member- uncovers a referral opportunity for you. This occurs without your direct involvement. You are generally not standing there when it happens. It would be great if you were, but generally, you are not standing there. You lay the groundwork for it by cultivating a mutually beneficial relationship with that person in BNI who is going to be motivated in BNI to provide you with the business prospects so that you can get that referral. That is step one. A source discovers a referral.

Step two. Research the referral. This is the step that very few people do. When the referral source tells you that they have a referral for you- at this stage, your impulse might be to call the prospect immediately and strike while the iron is hot. That really could be a mistake. In fact, it’s probably the most common mistake that people make. I have a referral. I’m going to call them right now. Don’t let your excitement cloud your judgment about your opportunities. As soon as you get the call from your referral source, you need to be doing a little research. Find out information about the prospect and their company. How big is the company? What is the prospect’s main line of business? How successfully does he compete? What is the company’s market? What products or services do they offer? What is the track record with vendors? Does it deal with people in a very straightforward manner? Is it in good financial condition? Google is a thing of beauty. I love doing searches on prospective clients and I recommend that you do searches. I certainly do searches on prospective vendors. Do a little bit of research.

Now, step number two and step number three and be a little somewhat tied together. We are talking about researching the referral. I advise you to do a Google search on the company or individual first. Then step three, check back in with your referral source to complete that research. Talk about the referral. First of all, you need to keep your referral source in the loop in order to make the referral work effectively. Talk to your referral source about the referral. You need to know more about them. Learn about them as an individual. Learn about them as a company from your referral source. Maybe they won’t have much to add, but many times they will have something to add.

What you don’t want to do is charge at the prospect with no idea of what is expected or desired. So ask some questions about what the discussion was when you got this referral. Have some certainty. Once you have some certainty about these factors, this will help you accomplish your two most important objectives: closing the sale and making your referral source look good. That second one is important. The person who referred you has got to look good in the process.

Your referral source discovers a referral. Research the referral. Check back in with the referral source. Then the fourth step is to meet with the referral. Now comes the move you have been waiting for. What happens is we tend to jump over two and three and go right to four to meet with the referral. They might close with you on your first call. That happens. The better your referral and the relationship between your referral source and the referral, the more likely that is to happen, but that is not real common. Instead, you are probably going to get acquainted with your potential new customer and gather more information to help prepare a proposal. This is an important aspect, but most people kind of have that down. That is their business. They know what to do once they get in front of a prospective client or customer.

Number five- this is one that is left out of most processes in the referral. That is to report back to the referral source and let him or her know the outcome of it. I think this is a really important one. Oftentimes, people leave several pieces out of this, and this is one of them. How many times has someone gotten back to you and said, “Hey. I met with them and this is what happened.”

Priscilla:
Yeah. Especially if it doesn’t go well. Then you hear about it.

Ivan:
Then you hear about it. Of course, sometimes in a great referral, your referral source will go with you to the meeting. Then they know what happened. Obviously, then you dopn’t need number five. If they go with you, that’s a better referral. That’s a high level referral. Let’s say they don’t. Contact them and tell them if you think it went well, if you don’t think it went well, whatever took place. Keep them in the loop because you want your referral source to look good.

Step six. Get feedback from your referral. This is almost never done. A fellow BNI member, if it’s possible and relevant- have them call the prospect and get some information on how it went. Get another perspective. They might hear something completely different than what you heard. This is really powerful, especially if your referral source has a good relationship with the person being referred. I do this all the time. When I refer somebody, I am sure to get back to them and let them know how it’s going. This is really left out. A number of things are left out. Researching your referral, reporting back to your source again. These often aren’t done. When they are done, it makes it a much stronger referral.

Number seven. Your referral source gets back to you. So your fellow BNI member gets back to you about the prospect. This really increases your chances of closing the deal if they can give you another prospective. Sometimes it might be like, “You did great. They are really impressed with you,” or “Here are their concerns. You might want to address this.”

Now we get to number eight. Close the deal. Now that you have all the details, you can close the deal. You have probably been told that you have to contact most prospects 20 times or more before they will buy. That may be true in ordinary marketing strategies but not in the referral marketing process. In the referral marketing process, it can be as little as two steps. Generally, you want to try to build in all eight steps. If it happens quicker, great. That is fantastic. But generally, if you can build in all eight steps, this really enhances that ability for referrals to turn into sales.

The eight step referral process is a formal procedure that is simple and comprehensive at the same time. It includes every single step that you may need to take in order to fully and properly develop a first time referral.

Priscilla, if members of a BNI group followed most or all of these eight steps, do you think it would improve their closing ratio on referrals?

Priscilla:
Yeah. I think it really would. Can I ask you a question? When I make a referral- I was just thinking about this- I normally ask the person who is interested in the service to call my referral. Then you are just kind of waiting for that to happen. It’s probably a lot better if I say, “Do you mind if my referral source calls you?” Right? It’s a small detail, but I was thinking about the referrals that I have given lately. Do you know what I mean?

Ivan:
So you’re saying to a person, “Do you mind if my referral gives you a call?” Yeah of course.

Priscilla:
That’s what I should be doing, I think.

Ivan:
Absolutely. Nothing wrong with that at all. The steps that are often left out are that conversation betwoeen the product or service and the person who gave the referral before they contact the actual referral. The two BNI members having a conversation. Do a little bit of research on the company and then have a little conversation with the person giving you the referral. You can do that the same day. I am not suggesting that you sit on referrals for very long because they go cold fast. Do that research as quickly as possible and then make that contact. That is really important. Do that research a quickly as possible and then make that contact. I think that is really, really important.

This podcast to me is a must-listen for all BNI groups. I think if every BNI chapter listened to this- education coordinators, this is a must-train to your members. If they understand this eight step process- do it over a two or three week period to make sure you can go deep with some of this. If they understand this process, I guarantee you, the quantity and quality of referrals that are going to be passed in your BNI group will go up substantially.

That’s all I’ve got today, Priscilla. I would love to hear comments from people. What do you think about this process? How has it worked for you when you’ve done it?

Priscilla:
Okay great. Thank you, Dr. Misner. I would just like to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the net for networking downloadables. Thank you so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice and we hope you will join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

Mike Macedonio joins Dr. Misner again this week to pick up where Episode 187 left off. So, what does your network need to know?

1. Referral marketing strategies. Invite a new BNI member to Member Success Program Training and go through it with them.
2. Who to refer to you. Make it easy for them to identify good prospects.
3. How to refer to you. Give them qualifying questions to ask, or a testimonial to share. Let them know your preferred next step.
4. Why they should refer you. Your number one responsibility is to make the referrer look good.

It’s important to get all four of these elements in place in order to generate a steady flow of referrals.

Find out more about Mike’s work at the Referral Institute, which has a strategic alliance with BNI.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 188 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, the leading site on the net for networking downloadables. I am Priscilla Rice, and I am coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, CA. I am joined today by the Founder and Chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner. Hello Ivan. How are you?

Ivan:
I am doing great, Priscilla, and this week I am in New Orleans for the Transformational Leadership Council, which I have talked about a couple of times on my podcasts. TLC is a business and training organization for transformational leaders. They invited me to join a few years ago when I met Jack Canfield. I met Jack Canfield at the same event in New Orleans. Well, not the same event, it was a different organization, but with my guest today on the call, Mike Macedonio. Mike was there when I met Jack Canfield about six or seven years ago, also in New Orleans. Mike, do you remember that meeting with Jack in New Orleans, where we did our first presentation on Truth or Delusion?

Mike:
I do remember that. It was a very memorable day, not only to meet Jack, but the entire day was quite special.

Ivan:
It really was. I am back in New Orleans at the TLC event today. I had an opportuntiy to meet a lot of members here as well. Today we are going to be talking about the question, what does my referral network really need to know to pass me business? Last week Mike was my guest on the podcast, and I have brought him back to do this second part, which ties in very well, which was the three core competencies to referral success.

Mike, just for listeners, in case you haven’t listened to the previous podcast, has been involved with BNI since 1997. He is currently the President of the Referral Institute, which is a referral training company throughout the world. He is also a really good friend and I spent time with Mike and the Referral Institute partners last week in Petaluma. Mike, it’s great to have you on the podcast.

Mike:
It’s great to be back, thank you.

Ivan:
Go ahead and talk about what your referral network needs to know to pass you business, and we are going to start with the knowledge of referral marketing strategies. That ties into the third topic that we talked about last week, which was to have an educated referral network. So do you want to pick it up from there?

Mike:
Last week, we were talking about the three core competencies. The third one was so critical- that our network is operating at the level we are, in terms of their knowledge of us and the referral process. We also talked about the importance of education, and once you get the education, to actually experience it with a referral partner and follow up with your referral network.

I look at networking training alone to be similar to going to a couples class alone. You are going to get some great information, but it is just not going to be as effective. One of the first things that we want to do is make sure that the people who plan to be in referral marketing with us understand referral marketing and understand referral strategies. So that is making sure that they understand how to play the sport.

Ivan:
That is a great analogy, by the way- going to a couples class alone. Have you ever seen anyone go through something like Member Success Program training with the person that they invited?

Mike:
Yes. On so many levels, it’s so powerful when the sponsor member brings the new member. They are showing the importance of that training, and at the same time, they are taking a huge step in building that relationship while spending time with them.

Ivan:
I think that is such a great idea, and I don’t see it done very often. That is a real nugget for the listeners here, going to Member Success Program training again with the person that you invited to BNI. That fits the strategy really well with having an educated referral network and doing that together. So do you want to jump into the second one, Mike? Who to refer to you?

Mike:
Really, your network needs to know who are your targeted prospects? Who do you want to meet? I think the key here is make it easy for them. Vague descriptions or assuming they understand what your business is and who would be a good prospect is most likely going to lead you to nobody. I know, Ivan, you have talked a lot about this in terms of techniques that BNI uses in chapters, 60-second or 30-second presentations. It’s critical that we need to make it easy for people to refer us. The phrase, “Specific is terrific,” is a great example of how to do that.

Ivan:
I think this is one of the areas where members really fall down. They are not really prepared. They just sort of wing it when it comes to their 60-second presentation. They are not specific enough. They are too vague, too general. “We are a full service_______” whatever, fill in the blank. That is nothing that anybody can hang their hat on. One of the things that I recommend is to think of the phrases, what I call the language of referrals: I can’t, I need, I want, I don’t know. What would someone say next to any of those phrases that would be a good referral for you? What if they said I can’t and then describe something that would be a good referral for you.

Whatever it takes, you need to think about how to be specific and how people can refer to you. It’s really important. Your third category is how to refer to you. How does that work?

Mike:
Once we think we have identified a possible prospect, the next step is the how? I have done this myself. We get so excited and think this is perfect. “You need to go talk to Ivan.” People take a step back. There should be a sales process in place of how people are going to refer to you. In other words, there are specific questions that they could be asking, similar to what you just mentioned, and maybe some qualifying questions in addition to that.

Do they have a testimonial they may be able to share about your business? “If this is an issue you are having, let me tell you about ____________ and the types of experiences their clients have had.” It helps to be able to share a testimonial.

Also, let them know what is the next step? Is this something you would like to call on? Would it be better if they called you? Or is there an event that you can go to and meet them in person? Make it very clear who they are and what they can do to make those personal introductions.

Ivan:
In the context of BNI, Mike, how do they apply this? What would you tell members in how they can apply these concepts of how to refer you at a BNI chapter?

Mike:
I think that one to one situations can be really powerful. All of those conversation starters are qualifying questions to ask on our behalf. We can’t assume that in the year that we have been doing business that another business owner is going to understand our business like we do, to know what questions to ask the prospect.

The second question we talked about is offering testimonials. Share with them or give them testimonials that they can share with their network. There are a number of ways that can be done. Certainly, verbally is one, but we have also seen where BNI members would share those testimonials through their websites or in their email signatures, which is another way of promoting their fellow members. Depending on the industry, I have seen plenty of referrals come through successfully simply by an email.

And then, with others, a personal introduction or a face to face. The best place to get the face to face introduction is actually at the BNI meeting. Bring them to the meeting. Again, depending on the nature of their work, this could be a great place to make this face to face.

Ivan:
Great idea. That is a good suggestion. I don’t think I talk about that very much, but when I was a BNI member, one of the things that I would do is bring somebody to the meeting and make the personal introduction. You jogged my memory on that one, Mike. That was a good idea.

So what does my referral network really need to know to pass me business? We talked about three things. Knowledge of referral marketing strategies. If you can go through training together, that is really powerful. We talked about being immersed in a culture of learning. Who to refer to you was the second one. How to refer to you is the third one. The last one is why refer you. Do you want to talk about that, Mike?

Mike:
The why is so crucial in this process. So many times we make the assumption that I am referring you because you are really good. Or, they are going to refer to you because you are a fellow BNI member. All of those are good reasons, but they are probably not going to be the true motivator of why they are going to want to refer you. This is something we should evaluate ahead of time and clearly communicate to our network- what we are going to do for them. Or find out what is important to them.

For example, one of the phrases that we say in the Referral Institute is that your number one responsibility when you receive a referral is make the referrer look good. If you are operating at that level-

Ivan:
Stop there. I want to talk about that for a second. That is the person who is giving you the referral. So hey, Mike, I know somebody who needs your product or service. Then you are saying that you need to make me look good to the person that you are about to do business with, right?

Mike:
Above everything else. Even above getting the business itself is most importantly to make you look good because you put your reputation on the line. If I do that, you are more likely to want to do it again and again and again.

Ivan:
That is a real interesting mindset there. That is something we don’t talk about much in BNI. Thyat particular strategy is a real powerful strategy. So when I give you a referral, your first mission is to make me look good to the person that I gave the referral to, the third party. So you are saying that you need to make me look good, and the more you do that for me, the more I want to refer you. Is that right?

Mike:
That is correct.

Ivan:
I want the listeners to think about that because that is a powerful thing that we rearely talk about in BNI. Education coordinators, that is a great topic to discuss at t BNI meeting as one of the reasons why to refer you. Great. I am sorry I cut you off. Go ahead, Mike.

Mike:
To expand on that, one of the things that we train our clients to do is in the first part of the conversation, when you meet with a referred prospect is to ask them about the person that referred them. Make them the first topic of conversation. You can also be reminding the prospect why you were recommended, and at the same time, you could be edifying the referral source by talking about your relationship with them and finding out more about their relationship with the person who referred you. This significantly changes the sales process when you go in with the relationship leveraging conversation.

Ivan:
I just love this concept. I think it is probably something that we could write about, you and I, Mike a lot more because this is one of those counter-intuitive things where people don’t think of this as a valuable aspect of networking, but this is really an important one. It’s a good reason for me to give you referrals.
Anything you want to say to summarize?

Mike:
Well, in summary, I believe that the referral process for our network really does include all four of these. It is really not a buffet, where you can take one or the other. They are all important. When you get all four in place, you are going to propel your referral network, you’re going to compel your referral partners to start giving you a steady flow of referrals.

Ivan:
That is great information, Mike. I really appreciate you sharing it. For the listeners, Mike Macedonio, President of the Referral Institute. Mike, how do they get a hold of you? We talked a little bit about the strategic alliance with BNI. I think these two organizations really go hand in hand and I urge members to take a look at training that the Referral Institute. So would you like to tell everybody how they can get a hold of you or the Referral Institute?

Mike:
One of the first places would be our website, www.ReferralInstitute.com. That will give you information as to whether we are in your country or your area. If we are not, feel free to contact me and I will be happy to discuss with you how we could bring the referral institute into your area. The best way to contact me is mikem@referralinstitute.com. I would love to have a conversation with you about bringing the Referral Institute into your area.

Ivan:
Mike, thank you so much for joining me on this podcast. You are a good friend, and you do a great job with the Referral Institute. BNI members could benefit from what you have to share. Thank you very much, and I’ll turn it back over to Priscilla.

Priscilla:
Okay great. Thank you both very much. I would just like to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the net for networking downloadables. Thanks for listening. This is Priscilla Rice and we hope you will join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

Mike Macedonio of the Referral Institute joins Dr. Misner to show us some genuinely effective techniques for referral marketing. (As co-author with Dr. Misner of Truth or Delusion, Mike has learned to separate the wheat from the chaff.) Here are three core competencies:

1. Get the right education. Learn from the experts.
2. Stay immersed with the information. Apply what you know.
3. Educate your referral network. That’s what BNI’s Leadership Team training is for. (Hint—you don’t have to be on the Leadership Team to take this training.)

If you want to know more about the Referral Institute, you can visit their website or contact Mike at mikem [at] referralinstitute [dot] com.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 187 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, the leading site on the net for networking downloadables. I am Priscilla Rice, and I am coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, CA. I am joined today by the Founder and Chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner. Hello Ivan. How are you, and where are you?

Ivan:
Hi Priscilla. It’s great to start the new year here in the second week of January. I am in Petaluma, CA at the Referral Institute’s conference. Because of that, my guest today is Mike Macedonio. Mike is the President of the Referral Institute. Mike’s relationship with BNI goes way back. Mike has been involved with the organization; he’s an Executive Director. He has been involved with BNI since 1997- a lot of experience in the organization. He is also my co-author of my NY Times best selling book, Truth or Delusion. Mike Macedonio is one of the co-authors with me.

I haven’t mentioned this in my podcast yet, but this year, in 2011, we will have the 4th Edition of The World’s Best Known Marketing Secret. Mike Macedonio will be my co-author in The World’s Best Known Marketing Secret, which is actually a combination of World’s Best Known and Business by Referral. I am sure I’ll talk about it sometime this year in my podcast.

So Mike is my guest today. Mike, welcome to the podcast.

Mike:
Thank you, Ivan. Thank you for having me on your podcast and welcome to Petaluma.

Ivan:
Thanks. The Referral Institute’s conferences are always very full of information, so this is a great opportunity to do this podcast. The topic today is the three core competencies to referral success. What is missing is an important aspect of this topic, so let’s start with what is missing?

Mike:
Well, I think if you look at the three core competencies, first, knowing what to do, secondly, doing it- the third thing is to have an educated network. Sometimes the third one is the stumbling block, but let’s take it in order.

Ivan:
The right referral marketing knowledge. Tell us about that.

Mike:
I think the first thing to go to is Ivan Misner who is a wealth of information on this. The one thing that I will say that we see out there in the world is that the information on referral marketing and networking runs from fantastic to fumbling terrible. The stuff that just fumbles along as good technique, in a lot of cases just doesn’t work at all. As a matter of fact, Ivan, you and I wrote an entire book on the truth or delusions of good networking.

One of the first commitments that any business owner needs to make at being effective in referral marketing is to go out there and learn from the experts. Find out what is working. Again, I will go back to you, Ivan. You have a wealth of information and knowledge that you share. This podcast is one of them. People on this podcast, obviously, are hungry for the knowledge and they want to learn from the best.

I also see BNI as having an endless amount of other resources, such as their Member Success Program, Leadership Team trainings, your books, the Del Fuego programs. Ivan, you probably have a list of others that you can share.

Ivan:
The SuccessNet is probably one of the best resources for BNI members, the Ask Ivan Misner website, which is sometimes a sponsor of the podcast is another great site. And as you mentioned, the many, many books.
So the right marketing knowledge is the first one. What is the second one? Stay immersed with the information. Tell us about that.

Mike:
We know the old saying, knowledge is not enough. We have to take that knowledge and apply it. Immersion is really where we take what we know and we start letting those lessons stick and behaviors changed to repetition. It is no different than exercise. You can know how hard to work out, but unless you are doing it and doing it on a regular basis, you are not going to get any significance in performance.

The more frequently we stay engaged in referral marketing and the longer we stay engaged in referral marketing, the more we fit it in to our lifestyle. It is not simply an event or something we turn on and turn off. One of my experiences with referral marketing is that a lot of it is counter-intuitive. When we think about going out there and looking for business, we go out there and look for business for ourselves. So much of referral marketing also involves looking for business for other people.

Ivan:
That is so true, Mike. I just read something on Entrepreneur.com’s Facebook page where people were talking about networking. The number one complaint was that they just go there to be sold to. They go to networking meetings and everybody and their mother is selling to them, which is very frustrating.

But staying immersed. In my podcast, I talk a lot about being immersed and engaged in a culture of learning. That is very important. But the third one is very important and you have a lot of additional information on this. This is the three core competencies to referral success. The third one is have an educated referral network. Do you want to talk about that?

Mike:
Yeah. This sometimes is where the referral process gets a little sticky. As listeners to this podcast, you probably are immersed in education. You are immersed in the process. You probably have some very frequent skills, but some of you actually may be frustrated with the process because your network isn’t equally as educated and isn’t equally as skilled. This is critical to the referral process because it is a team sport.

On the first level, of course, they need to know who you are, what you do, who to refer to you and how to refer you. Just as importantly, they need to have an understanding of the referral marketing process. What are the strategies? What are the things that are going to make them more effective in generating more referrals for you? It would be equated to a professional athlete going out on the field with a peewee team. He is going to get very frustrated with their skills.

One of the nice things about BNI is it offers so many opportunities for the chapters to get educated and the chapters to learn together how to perform better as a team. You know, years ago as an Executive Director, I started to notice trends in my region. I would notice that certain months, the chapters would have significant growth. They would pass a significant amount of business. Then it would come down, and then it would take off again. When I looked at those trends year in and year out, I was noticing they always happened following our Leadership Team trainings.

Of course, the initial reaction was it has to be the training. With more training they were getting better at it and performing better after they left the training. But there was another thing that I started to notice. I started to notice that the chapters who had the most members attending the Leadership Team trainings were producing the better results in the region. Again, I misinterpreted that because I thought it was just the number of members at training that was producing the results.

It took me a number of years to actually realize that it was all of that plus the fact that they were experiencing the training together. Individually getting training would help, but when they did it together, they came back and played better as a team. I think this is one of the greatest opportunities that BNI members have. They have Leadership Team training, and these opportunities to go together.

I know, Ivan, this is unique, and I’m just experiencing my experience in the United States. But you would know better- is that something that happens across the organization?

Ivan:
Yeah. It absolutely does, and when you see regions that have everyone in the Leadership Team going through the training, which they are required to do- but when you have it happen consistently, that is when you have regions that tend to be more successful. But the ones that are really successful are the regions where more than just the Leadership Team goes. There are many regions of this organization where not just the three people- President, Vice President, Secretary, Treasurer (in some countries called the Chapter Director , Membership Coordinator, Secretary, Treasured). Whatever the title, oftentimes, many other people go to the Leadership Team trainings: the Visitor host, the membership committees, people in other roles within the chapter go.

When you have a chapter that sends a lot of people, that is really getting the group immersed and engaged in this culture of learning that I think is so important. So do you want to summarize for us, Mike?

Mike:
Yes. Just to review, our three core competencies is get the right education and learn in from the true experts in referral marketing. Secondly, take the information and stay immersed in the information. Practice the skills and make it a lifestyle. Lastly, take every opportunity you can to get your network educated about what you do and who you are looking to get referred, but also on the referral marketing process. Again, BNI offers a great opportunity for us to do that with our members on a consistent basis weekly, but also on the training that happens throughout the year.

Ivan:
Thanks Mike. The Referral Institute certainly takes that at an even much deeper level. I would like to let all of the members know that BNI has a long term strategic alliance with the Referral Institute. I like to call it a strategic alliance on steroids. You know, I am involved in both organizations. You run the Referral Institute, but the Referral Institute uses a lot of the content that I developed in my books and in our books. We have a really strong relationship.

I think that BNI is sort of vocational school for networking. It is where the rubber meets the road. You learn what you need to know to make a BNI meeting successful for you, but Referral Institute is really graduate school training. It’s where you go deep and explain how to build your business through referrals. So take a few seconds, if you don’t mind, Mike, to tell everybody about the Referral Institute, which is really the basis of much of your expertise in this field.

Mike:
The Referral Institute is a training and consulting company. Our specialty is referral marketing. Along with success in BNI, we also look at all the other sources of referrals that a company has and make sure that they have systems and a message in place that can be marketed by word of mouth and referrals. With getting a lot of the information that you have provided, Ivan, and a number of our other trainers in the company, we’ve had the pleasure of expanding into an international company doing well working side by side with BNI.

Ivan:
If someone wants to get information on the Referral Institute, where do they go?

Mike:
They can come to the website, which is ReferralInstitute.com, or feel free to email me at mikem@referralinstitute.com.

Ivan:
Mike, thank you so much for being on this podcast. We are also going to have you on next week to talk a little bit more about what your referral network really needs to know in order to pass you business. We are going to do that next week. To the listeners of the BNI Podcast, thank you so much, and I’ll turn it over to you, Priscilla.

Priscilla:
Thank you both very, very much. I think that is it for this week. I would like to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the net for networking downloadables. Thank you for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and we hope you will join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

Synopsis

This week Brian Buffini joins Dr. Misner to discuss creating a proactive system for referrals. You need a systematic approach to cultivate referrals on a daily basis. The essence of it is:

• Build relationships
• Provide value
• Remind the people in your database that you’re looking for referrals

This requires sorting your database by your most valuable customers and who is most likely to refer you. Then you take a three-step approach to dealing with those people, and set aside time for it every day.

1. Contact
2. Care
3. Community

For more information about Brian Buffini’s trainings, go to the Buffini and Company website. You’ll find live seminars and coaching and mentoring programs. Dr. Misner endorses this system wholeheartedly, and Priscilla is an active client.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 165 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables.

I’m Priscilla Rice, and I’m coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, California, and I’m joined on the phone today by the founder and the chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner.

Hello, Ivan. How are you today?

Ivan:
I am doing great, Priscilla. And I’m really excited because I have a guest on the line. He is a friend, a friend of BNI. His name is Brian Buffini. Brian is one of those who is extremely knowledgeable about referral marketing and, here’s where you find people who are knowledgeable, but they’re not really good at the second part, Brian walks the talk. He has been a huge supporter of BNI for many, many years. We have really appreciated his support of our organization and I highly recommend the training program that Brian does, and I’m really excited to have him on our podcast today.

Brian, do you want to say “Hi”?

Brian:
Well, hello, Ivan. Great to be with you here today. The feelings are mutual; we’ve been very excited to endorse BNI to the people we coach and the people we have in our live events over the years. And we have such great, great results with that. We have some of the folks we coach who talk about 50 percent of their income comes from the referrals they get from Business Network International. So we keep referring you, and they keep being more successful, so it’s a win-win situation.

Ivan:
Well, I’ll tell you something that I said when we first met years ago, and that is, I can walk into a BNI meeting and I can immediately tell when somebody has been trained in your training program. They absolutely stand out as a superior member in our program, because they go deeper in the process, and it’s not as superficial as some people. Some people – I hate to say it, but some people come to BNI and their only networking is what they do at that meeting, and I can always tell when there’s somebody who’s been through your training, because they’re all about building relationships and drilling deep for the referrals.

So it’s great to have you on the podcast. Let me ask you this question.

Brian:
Well, it’s great to be with you.

Ivan:
Thanks.

Tell me about the referrals. What is the power of referral marketing? And you are absolutely one of the world’s experts in this, and I think my members get benefit from hearing it from you.

Brian:
Well, no doubt. I think the big difference for me is, my dad would have been a classic BNI member. He was a house painter in Dublin, Ireland, and my father always used to say, “The work will speak for itself.” So my father was committed to doing a great job. In fact, all of us kids, we grew up in the family painting business, and every day my grandfather, who was kind of the Mr. Miyagi of our family; he mentored you and trained you in the business, and every day he’d ask you, “Can you put your name to the work you did?” And if you didn’t put your name to the work you’d done, you had to do it over, whether the customer saw it or not.

So doing a great job for people was imperative, and that’s where my father and grandfather knew their future business would come from. So they were very, very committed to what you would call a word-of-mouth business. And so I was raised in that, so that’s what I knew.

Now, when I immigrated to America and got into the real estate business, I was looking for referrals, but I found that the rhythm of waiting for referral, like the way my father and grandfather had, wasn’t working for me. So I had to go and cultivate it on purpose, and that’s where over a period of a number of years I developed a proactive system to cultivate referrals. And that’s really where it goes from word-of-mouth to working by referral, is that you have a systematic approach to intentionally cultivate referrals on a daily basis.

As we’ve talked about, Ivan, the people in our coaching program from real estate and lending side, for example, they earn seven times that of the national average. And it’s not that they’re any smarter or work any harder, they actually do it typically with less advertising budgets, but it’s done in regards to a systematic approach to your database and building relationships, providing value, and reminding those people that you’re looking for referrals. And so I think this is a big thing where a lot of folks, they do a great job, they’re committed to customer service, and they get the occasional referral, but you can’t count on it; you don’t know when the next referral is coming in, you can’t predict it.

And so our system is that you build, sort, and qualify your database. The database isn’t just something on a computer; it’s a list of relationships. And you have some business relationships that are closer than others. And in our system, we encourage you to spend more time, more energy, more effort with those clients that are the better clients, the most likely to refer you, those who have referred you in the past, those who’ve done the most business with you. So instead of the squeaky wheel getting the grease, in this system, the squeaky wheel really doesn’t get any of your time at all. So we’re investing time, energy, and resources in building relationships with our best customers and our best referral advocates.

So the first thing you have to really get familiar with your database, know who you have, know who they are, and then know a little bit about them. And many of your books go into great detail about how to do that. Where we, then, go is providing systematic approach, and we have a thing we call the Three Cs, which is Contact, Care, and Community. So you want to contact these folks. You’ve got to be seeing them in person, you’ve got to be calling them, you’ve got to be connecting with them. We believe in marketing to folks proactively, so providing something of value.

So rather than a Realtor who traditionally sends out a note pad with their picture on it or a football schedule or a recipe card for potpies, we’re providing something of value. So for example, here’s how to raise your credit score; here’s how to protect yourself from identity theft; here’s the 15 new laws, the tax laws that just came down that can help you with your tax burdens for real estate and other things. So practical, tactical things that are items of value.

Sometimes it’s a little more fun. The postage rate changes by a couple of cents, and you’ll send your customers 20 two-cent stamps in the mail. And just little tokens, little items of value that give you a chance to build the relationship deeper with the customer.

Then we recommend you go see them, you go have coffee with them, you build relationships, and then you systematically ask people for referrals. And this is something that we’ve done in our own coaching program. You talk about walking the talk; we’ve been doing this for years ourselves where our company grew on average by 49 percent a year for ten years by generating referrals from our customer base.

So it just flat out works; it just flat out works. It’s a systematic approach to a dedicated group of people familiarizing yourself with the database, building relationships with them, providing something of value, then you’ve got to go out and see them.

And then, I guess, the last little piece to this puzzle here, just in giving an overview, is just having a daily set of activities set aside. So for us, we have a little process we call the Win the Day Formula. And it basically is two hours of cultivating leads, of generating leads, of spending time with your database, talking to your database, connecting with your database, and letting them know that you’re never too busy for their referrals, and actually, kind of going from schmoozing to cultivating, and I think that’s really a key component here.

And so the number one thing, and I think you’ve seen this probably throughout BNI, Ivan, is that the people who do well in business are people who are committed to generating leads. So many people are dealing with the symptoms of a lack of leads, inconsistent income, poor quality customer, or you end up dealing with the high maintenance customer. Well, if you’re generating – in my business in real estate, I was averaging 35 referrals a month. Well, when you’re generating 35 referrals a month, you’re going to get a couple of bad apples.

Ivan:
Yeah.

Brian:
You’re going to get people that, “Hey, I want you to do this for almost free; I want you this;” they’re high maintenance; they’re after you all the time.

And you go, “You know what, I just don’t think we’re a good fit for one another.”

Well, you can say that when you have a bunch of lead. That’s hard to say that when you don’t have any leads.

Ivan:
Yeah, when you feel that the pipeline is full and there’s a lot of business coming, then it’s easier to say that, no question about it.

Brian:
Right, right. So, Ben Franklin said, “Tis hard for an empty purse to stand upright.” So we all tend to fold when the bank account’s empty, when we need food with our meals.

Ivan:
Well, you know what else Franklin said, and I talked about this in one of my previous podcasts, is that – he seemed to have a thing with purses – he said, “If you empty your purse into your head, you’re gaining something that no one can ever take away and that’s knowledge.”

Brian:
Yeah, best investment of all time.

Ivan:
Absolutely, and that’s exactly what you’re doing, what BNI is all about. And we do training in BNI, but there’s only so deep we can go in our weekly meetings. So your program’s all about really going deep with people and giving them systems. I love systems. That’s what BNI is all about, is a system.

Brian:
Right.

Ivan:
But it’s those systems for following up, and I think that’s what’s made your students sell much better, BNI members is that the system that they have they employ, they employ not only in BNI but in their business, as a rule.

Well, listen, tell us briefly, because we’re almost out of time, tell us about your trainings and where people can get information. There’s very few podcasts – and listeners, you know this is true – very few podcasts that I recommend go to a training or read a book. This is one of the few ones, and the reason for that is I so believe in the kind of training Brian does.

And so tell them a little bit about where they can go, Brian.

Brian:
We appreciate that, Ivan. BuffiniAndCompany.com is – my name, Buffini, B-U-F-F-I-N-I, AndCompany.com, has a lot of layout of where we do our live events, where we do our systematic training called 100 Days to Greatness, and then ultimately, our coaching programs. And it’s a wonderful thing. We have, obviously, a number of mutual members where we have a number of BNI folks we’ve been able to kind of help get to the next level by coaching them one on one in an in-depth capacity.

We have kind of an unusual setup in that we have like a 90,000 square foot headquarters in Carlsbad in California where we have a highly skilled, trained staff of coaches that coach people one on one, a lot of Realtors, a lot of lenders, but we also have about 15 percent of our business is general market folks in many walks of life.

So we get a great opportunity to coach folks one on one in the systematic approach of generating leads, holding folks accountable, teaching them these systems, bringing them to our live events, and it’s a lot of fun. It’s a lot of fun to see people grow and prosper. And yours is an organization right now that’s doing very well and continues to prosper because of the value you provide, and then we try to do the same in the coaching side of the business in helping folks grow their business, run their business like a business, and then holding them accountable, and it seems to work very well.

Ivan:
Well, I’ve been to your facilities. I was very impressed. You have an amazing team there and a great operation. And I think it’s interesting that Priscilla, who’s our host on these shows.

Priscilla, you’ve been to Brian’s program.

Priscilla:
Yeah, I’m an active client. I get all his materials. I send them out. I did my first client party this year, and that’s something that Brian has been promoting and telling us to do forever and the coaches tell you to do. And I discovered why it’s so magical to do that, and I’m a great believer in that. I love his system.

Ivan:
Well, Brian, thank you so much for your comments.

Priscilla, I appreciate your endorsement, your testimonial.

We do testimonials in BNI, so it’s a perfect segue into this.

And listeners, if you have a chance, go to BuffiniAndCompany, that’s A-N-D, BuffiniAndCompany.com to take a look at what Brian and his team have put together. It’s one of the few training programs that I recommend in networking.

So Brian, thank you so much.

Priscilla, back to you.

Priscilla:
Okay, great! Thank you both very much.

I’d just like to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables. Thanks so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and we hope you’ll join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

Make sure you listen to Part 1 of this topic.

This week Dr. Misner addresses the next five levels of referrals, starting with number six. Each level is more desirable than the last.

1. Your referral source makes a personal phone call on your behalf.
2. Your referral source arranges a meeting between you and the prospect.
3. Your referral source introduces you to the prospect in person.
4. Your referral source assesses the need and interest of the prospect.
5. A closed deal: your referral source makes the sale for you.

Your best source of referrals is your power partner, because that person comes into contact with prospective clients and customers all the time.

Brought to you by Ask Ivan Misner.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 156 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by AskIvanMisner.com, which is a Web site where you can ask Ivan any question you have about networking.

I’m Priscilla Rice, and I’m coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, California, and I’m joined on the phone today by the founder and the chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner.

Hello, Ivan. How are you?

Ivan:
I am doing great, Priscilla. Thank you very much.

Priscilla:
What do you have for us today?

Ivan:
Well, we have a follow-up from last week’s podcast; this is Part 2 about referral levels. Not all referrals are created equal. And last week I talked about that fact, that referrals aren’t equal and that there are different levels of a referral. The more time and effort you put into your referral sources, into qualifying, educating, and encouraging prospects for your referral sources, the higher the quality and level of referral.

So I talked about Level 1 through Level 5 last week. And Level 1, frankly, is not much better than a cold call; we really shouldn’t be giving out Level 1 referrals. But Level 5 is really a letter of introduction and promotion. I ended on that, and so let me start with Level 6, which is an introductory call and promotion. It’s another level up in terms of effort with your referral source.

If you make a personal phone call on their behalf, it takes preparation and effort, but a telephone call is more effective than a letter for paving your way to communicate with prospects. As I said earlier, given a Level 1, you still have 95 percent of the work to do, which is not much better than a cold call. So the referral levels that I’m giving are definitely more desirable as you work your way up from 5 to 6 to 7.

Level 7 referral is to arrange a meeting. When your referral source arranges a meeting, they move beyond the role of promoter to that of facilitator by taking the responsibility of working on the details of getting you and the prospect together. This is a big time referral effort and I would consider a very high level referral.

Number 8, or Level 8 referral is an in-person introduction and promotion. It’s more than just arranging the meeting; at this level, your referral source is making a serious commitment of time and energy to support your business by agreeing to serve as an intermediary in a face-to-face instruction. So you literally introduce both parties together. I think this is a real demonstration of the deep trust and approval of your product or service, and it can substantially raise the referral’s effectiveness with a prospect.

A Level 9 referral is an assessment of need and interest. In this level, your referral source has really done the work of assessing the need of a prospect and may have your product or service themselves and have gauged the prospect’s interest in learning more about it. And this really enables you to focus your selling efforts on needs that you know the prospect has intention to fill. And so it’s where somebody knows you well and they’re able to represent your product or service. And we’ve all been there with some products or services. I mean, there are some people’s work that we are zealots about, we love what they do, and so we almost make the sale for them in effect by saying, “Oh, yeah. They do this and they do that, and this is an example of it.” So it’s a very, very high level of referral where you are assessing the person’s needs and giving them feedback on what kind of product or service they need from this person. By the time you put them together, it’s almost a closed deal.

And the Level 10 referral is a closed deal. It’s the top level. The sale has really been closed before the contact even meets the prospect, and it’s solely based on the strength of the referral source’s efforts. There’s really nothing else required at this level except to deliver the product or service and collect payment. And these are really rare, but they happen.

Priscilla:
Yeah.

Ivan:
I’ve given referrals, and I’ve talked to people and presented the product or service so well that they basically said, “Boy, just have them call me; I’m in, I’ll buy.”

Priscilla:
Yeah.

Ivan:
And when that happens, it’s a done deal. Those referrals are a thing of beauty, but you have to remember they’re rare, and they tend to come from the people who really know you best and can represent what you do very effectively.

So what we’ve done this week and last week, we’ve talked about a Level 1 referral, which is a fairly marginal referral, to a Level 10 referral, which is basically a closed deal. One thing we know about referrals is that it’s easier for your referral source to close the deal than it is for you, in some ways, because your source already has a relationship with and trust with you. So a referral where the referral source has already closed the deal, it’s because of your relationship, and it really comes back down to the relationship issue. The stronger the relationships you have, the easier it is to get a higher level referral.

Priscilla:
Yeah, I was just thinking as you were talking that when you have a Power Partner relationship with somebody and you’ve done a lot of work together, you can give very high referrals.

Ivan:
Power Partners are a great example of what we’re talking about here. This is where you are in a Context Sphere, you have a symbiotic relationship, the caterer, the florist, the photographer, the travel agent. It’s a symbiotic relationship and it’s not just – a Context Sphere are the people that fit within that symbiotic relationship. Your Power Team are the people that you are actually implementing that relationship, you have a relationship, it’s not just a symbiotic profession, but it’s a symbiotic profession that is part of your efforts, your Power Team.

Priscilla:
Right.

Ivan:
So it’s sort of a subset, sub-circle of a Context Sphere. And you’re absolutely right; those are probably the best people that can give high level referrals.

You know, I always talk to members and people at my speaking engagements, and they say, “Well, aren’t your clients your best source of referrals?” And the truth is that’s not always the case. They can be a referral source for you, don’t get me wrong, and you should certainly be asking them for referrals. But oftentimes, your best source of referrals are people that come from your Power Team, just as you suggested, because they’re meeting the people that need your products and services all the time, because they’re in that symbiotic profession. And that’s probably one of the best places for you to focus fair amount of time and energy.

Priscilla:
And the trickiest part is just figuring out who your Power Partner could be and bringing that person into the chapter if you don’t have someone of that profession.

Ivan:
Yeah, you’re right. Figuring out what profession is the first part, and making sure that you’ve got somebody that you feel comfortable working with, that they’re good at what they do, that you like working with them. It’s hard working to work with a Power Partner that you don’t like to work with.

Priscilla:
Yeah, um-hmm.

Ivan:
If there’s any overlap in the services that you provide, there’s got to be a relationship where you trust that they’re not going to take away business but that they’re going to, in fact, give you the business that they don’t do and not try to take it away. And so you’re right, you’ve got to make sure you feel comfortable with this person, but as you develop that, wow, it’s reall probably one of the best sources of the higher level referrals.

Priscilla:
And the last thing I felt like saying is just that it’s so exciting when you can come up with a really great referral for somebody that’s pre-sold and they just get the work. It’s so wonderful.

Ivan:
Doesn’t it feel great!? It really does.

Priscilla:
Yeah!

Ivan:
One of the things I love about BNI is that it’s the classic example of Givers Gain mentality, that you really feel good to be able to help somebody else do well, especially in the economic climate that we’re in today. We are changing the way the world does business in BNI; we’re doing it by understanding how and why it’s important to give higher level referrals.

Priscilla:
Yeah, great!

Ivan:
Well, thanks, Priscilla. I appreciate it.

Priscilla:
Oh, you’re so welcome, Ivan. Thank you.

Well, I think that’s it for this week. So I would just like to remind you listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by AskIvanMisner.com. Thanks so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and we hope you’ll join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

All referrals are not created equal. They very in quality depending on how much effort your referral source has invested in preparing them. This week we’ll talk about the first  5 levels, starting with the lowest levels first.

1. Name and contact info only.
2. Source gives prospect your literature and company information.
3. Prospect is expecting your call.
4. Source has given prospect a testimonial or letter of recommendation.
5. Source writes a letter (or e-mail) of introduction and promotion.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 155 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables.

I’m Priscilla Rice, and I’m coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, California, and I’m joined on the phone today by the founder and the chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner.

Hello, Ivan. How are you?

Ivan:
I am doing great today, Priscilla, and we’re going to do a two part podcast here today and again next week. Now, this is A Referral is a Referral, Right? Wrong. It’s not. A referral isn’t a referral; there are different levels of referrals. You see, all referrals are not, in fact, equal. Referrals come in many different grades, and they vary in quality according to how much involvement your referral source has invested in preparing the referral for you.

So what I want to do in this podcast is give you the first five levels, that I would consider to be the first five levels of referral. And then next week we’re going to talk about the second five levels, and as you move up the levels, they become better and better referrals.

Priscilla:
Okay.

Ivan:
So we’ll start low and work our way up. The first is basically a name and contact information only. This isn’t really much better than just having a name to call. It only indicates that your referral source has done just enough work to provide you with a phone number and address or some other way of contacting the prospect, and the prospect is willing to talk to you.

And interestingly enough, the name and contact information only is oftentimes the referrals that are generated in networking groups, and we can do better than that. That’s the lowest level of a referral. They may be hot, they may be really excited and they want to talk, but you can actually – if you want to increase and give better referrals, there’s more you can do than just get the name and contact information.

The second level of a referral involves literature and company information. When a referral source offers to give a contact your marketing literature or other information about your business, you can be certain that the prospect will see that material and that the prospect’s interest in the product or service won’t depend solely on that but it will help in the relationship, so it’s a name, contact information, and you’ve given them company information; you’ve given the prospect company information as well. So they’re going into this with more than just, “Hey, I know somebody. Is it okay if I have them call you?”

Which is the third level, you want to make sure that the referral source has authorized you to use his or her name. You want to make sure that they’re expecting that call, and so that’s an important part of the process. By allowing you to say that they endorse your product or service, your source has really given you a valuable leverage with the prospect. So you want to make sure that you let the person know that, “Hey, I’m going to put the two of you in touch.”

The fourth level of a referral is a general testimonial or letter of recommendation. In here, you’re getting a referral source to say or write nice things about you, and that’s, I think, sometimes it can be a major accomplishment, especially if you’re getting a lot of these that you can put together in a book. The willingness to communicate positively about you and your business shows that you’ve built a level of trust with them, and testimonials and letters of recommendation are fairly common in the business world. And you use that letter of recommendation as part of the referral that you’re actually giving out.

And then the fifth level is a letter of introduction and promotion. This is sort of the first level of referral that truly involves a modicum of effort on the part of the referral source, unlike a letter of recommendation, which requires little more than a written endorsement, the letter of introduction implies a more substantive relationship between you and the referral source. It usually includes background information and a description of your product or service as filtered through the lens of the author, of course. It also implies that the prospect will be hearing from the person you’re referring.

I do this all the time, particularly with e-mail introductions for Internet, I would do a letter. But now I use e-mail, and I’ll say, “Person A, let me introduce you to Person B. Person B, this is Person A. This is how I’ve used this individual. I highly recommend them. You’ve said it’s okay if I put them in touch with you, and so here they are.” As a matter of fact, I just did it last night with two people, a friend of mine and a prospect, and I just made the introduction via e-mail. “You ask that I put you in touch with this person that I’ve been talking about; here they are.” I had already sent him literature, I had already sent him material. This isn’t just a warm referral; this is really a hot referral, and now I’ve put the two of them together through that letter of introduction; in this case, it was via e-mail. And adding that element of promotion really increases the effectiveness of the referral source’s efforts on your behalf.

So those are the first five levels of referral, and maybe we can chat about that for a minute or two, and then next week, we’ll talk about the next five levels.

Priscilla:
Okay, great! I got one of those electronic referrals recently, and I answered back. It was a little bit odd. I cc’d the person who sent it, as well, when I answered, but I never got a response. So now I’m left with, “What should I do next?” You know what I mean? They put me together, sent me an e-mail.

Ivan:
Did the person that sent you the e-mail, did they say, “Let me introduce you to –

Priscilla:
Yeah.

Ivan:
– this person; and this person here, here’s Priscilla”? Did you see their e-mail address

Priscilla:
Yes, and I sent them back an e-mail and I cc’d the person who sent it to me as well. And then I introduced myself and said, “I’d love to meet with you and have coffee” or whatever.

Ivan:
And you never heard back?

Priscilla:
No, never heard back. Isn’t that odd?

Ivan:
Well, my recommendation would be for you to connect with the person that gave you the referral and to let them know that. You don’t have to put them on the spot, but you simply say, “Hey, you saw the e-mail that I sent so-and-so, and I just wanted to let you know that they hadn’t gotten back to me yet. And it’s possible that” – and this has happened to me many times where an e-mail has gotten caught in my spam filter .

Priscilla:
Um-hmm, right.

Ivan:
And so somebody is saying, “Hey, I sent you an e-mail and you didn’t get it,” and then I do a really more thorough search through my spam filter, and wah lah, there they are.

Priscilla:
Yeah, yeah.

Ivan:
So you really never know. It could also be that they’re out of town, they’re swamped. There’s so many reasons. It may or may not be that they’re ot interested.

Priscilla:
Right.

Ivan:
It could be that it’s not a good referral, but my advice is follow through to make sure that the person got the information. One technique to do that, of course, is to send it with a receipt required, so what I do when I want to make sure somebody has received something – it’s too late now, I mean, you’ve already sent it and you don’t want to look pushy. So my advice would be to talk to the person who gave you the referral and have them contact the person and just say, “Hey, Priscilla mentioned that she e-mailed you; she hadn’t heard back. Are you still interested?” Something simple like that. “Are you still interested in talking to her? Would it be better that she call you or e-mail you again?”

Priscilla:
Right. Well, what’s the receipt requested? Can you describe that quickly?

Ivan:
When you, particularly in Outlook, there’s a feature that when you send an e-mail, you go to the Options and there’s two options there that you can select; one is Request the Delivery Receipt and the other is Request a Read Receipt. Now, the Request the Delivery Receipt means that you know that it went through the system and got to their e-mail program. Now, the problem with that is it can get to my e-mail account but it dropped into my Junk e-mail box.

Priscilla:
Um-hmm, right.

Ivan:
So that doesn’t tell you the person actually saw it; it just tells you it went through all the exterior filters and got to their interior e-mail system.

Because I have two levels of spam filters; I have an exterior spam filter that doesn’t even get to in-house, and then when it comes in-house, I have a second spam filter in Outlook. I get so much spam, and my e-mail has been out there for so many years, I get a lot of spam, so it could end up in my Junk e-mail.

What this tells somebody, if the Request of Delivery Receipt comes back saying yes, it was delivered, it tells them that it was delivered in-house but it may not have actually been read. So the second one is Request a Read Receipt, and that’s where somebody opens the e-mail and they get a popup that says, “So-and-so would like to confirm that you received this, yes or no. And when you hit yes, you know the person saw the e-mail.

I always do that when I want to make sure somebody has seen it and I want to know if they haven’t. And so that’s a good technique to use. Make sense?

Priscilla:
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I like that technique.

Ivan:
It’s under the Options category for Outlook.

Priscilla:
Okay, great!

Ivan:
So there’s a couple ideas; hope that helps.

And for everyone listening to this podcast, come back next week; we’ll give you Part 2 where we’ll get to the next five levels of a referral. Your goal should be to always give at least a level one referral, but the more you can improve that and give a higher level referral, the better.

Priscilla:
Perfect. Okay, thank you, Dr. Misner.

Ivan:
Thank you, Priscilla.

Priscilla:
I would just like to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables. Thanks so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and we hope you’ll join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

Dr. Misner posted his story about premature solicitation on some of his favorite social networks. Most people expressed their horror and sympathy, but one person actually wrote,

“I don’t happen to believe that you need a relationship with the person you are asking first. What you must have is a compelling story or product or service that would genuinely benefit the referral. The fact that you had not cultivated a relationship with the person has become irrelevant, because more importantly, you’d been in a position to help your contact benefit from the introduction. If it’s of genuine benefit to the person being referred, I don’t see the problem. It’s about the benefit of what’s being referred rather than the relationship with the person that’s asking for the referral. Who am I to deny my contacts something good?”

Everybody thinks they have a good product. How do you know whether you’re denying your contacts something good if you don’t know anything about this person or their product?

Some people don’t get it even when you explain it to them.

Brought to you by Ask Ivan Misner.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 148 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by AskIvanMisner.com, which is a new Web site where you can ask Ivan any question you have ever had about networking.

I’m Priscilla Rice, and I’m coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, California, and I’m joined on the phone today by the founder and the chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner.

Hello, Ivan. How are you and where are you?

Ivan:
This week I’m in Austin, Texas. I’m doing some recording for a follow-up CDs to the BNI Networking Secrets. We’ve talked about Networking Secrets on these podcasts, and the del Fuego ladies, Sarah and Flynn, have come up with some great ideas for a follow-up CD. Everyone’s going to be seeing those soon. We’ll be recording them, and we’ll bring it up here on the podcast as soon as they’re ready. And that’s what I’m doing in Austin this week.

Priscilla:
That sounds great. I loved the last ones they did.

Ivan:
Thank you.

Priscilla:
So what’s your topic? What are you going to talk to us about?

Ivan:
Well, remember last week’s topic? I spoke about premature solicitation.

Priscilla:
Uh-huh.

Ivan:
It was about a situation where someone whom I never met, didn’t know asked me to introduce him and his product to a really important connection of mine. Well, I wrote that as a blog on NetworkingNowBlog.com, which is my blog. For those of you listening, if you haven’t gone to it, take a look at it, NetworkingNowBlog.com. And I shared what I posted up on the blog and a few other different venues, I shared what I talked about in the podcast last week and a few other different venues, including one of my favorite online social networks. And a great dialogue ensued when I posted this on one of the social networks, with most people sharing their horror stories and frustrations about people who pounce on them; you know, they just jump on them at networking meetings asking for business even though they’ve never met the person before.

Well, every time I start to think that’s it’s an almost universal feeling of distaste for that approach to networking. I am brought back to reality by the minority of people who still think that this is actually a good networking technique, pouncing on somebody asking for business before you know them.

To my astonishment, someone on the forum actually wrote – now, I am going to quote you their actual words. They’re totally serious with what I’m about to say. This is excerpted from a very long message on the forum. They said, and I quote,
“I don’t happen to believe that you need a relationship with the person you are asking first. What you must have is a compelling story or product or service that would genuinely benefit the referral. The fact that you had not cultivated a relationship with the person has become irrelevant, because more importantly, you’d been in a position to help your contact benefit from the introduction. If it’s of genuine benefit to the person being referred, I don’t see the problem. It’s about the benefit of what’s being referred rather than the relationship with the person that’s asking for the referral. Who am I to deny my contacts something good?” end quote.

Wow! What can I say? The relationship is irrelevant?! All you have is a good story or product or service, and I owe it to any stranger who says that he or she has a good product? And that I should introduce them to a good contact of mine? Really?! People really think this way? According to this writer, it didn’t matter if I actually knew or trusted the person who wanted the business, as long as the person had a good product, or at least he said he had a good product, I should refer that person because would deny my contacts something good.

Priscilla, have you ever met anyone in business who said, “My product sucks. I really have a bad product. Would you refer me?”

Priscilla:
Never.

Ivan:
No, of course not. Everybody thinks they have a good product. They’d never say it’s a bad product. Everybody is saying that. And so what I just find incomprehensible is that anyone would say – and I’ve been doing this 25 years, and I think some of it is – part of the problem is I hang out with BNI member too much, because I really believe that BNI members get it for the most part. Maybe people are coming in new, takes them a little time, but for the most part, I’m talking to people who understand that it’s all about relationships.

So when I get into an environment with people who just don’t get it at all and they tell me, “Look, I have a good product. You should just trust that I have a good product, and you should put be in touch with your best contacts,” and they mean it, it is just incomprehensible to me. I just had to talk about that in a podcast. The one we did last week, Premature Solicitation, I’ll tell you, a really good friend of mine, T. R. Garland, actually started a Facebook page called Facebook Users Who Are Tired of Premature Solicitation (Oh my!).” That’s the title of the fan page, “Facebook Users Who Are Tired of Premature Solicitation (Oh my!).” He created that for BNI members and anyone else who wants to talk about this subject. I’d love for BNI members to comment here on this blog and go take a look at that Facebook page, because there’s some interesting dialogue that’s taking place over there, too.

Priscilla:
I think that the only time that might work is if somebody that you knew had used the product and could recommend that person or recommend the product.

Ivan:
Isn’t that really what the relationship is all about? You’ve got to have a relationship. If the person is coming to me and asking for me connect them with the other person, if I know them and trust them and I know they’ll do a good job, I don’t mind making the connection. But when you’re talking about somebody who’s a complete stranger telling you that they have a great product and just the fact that they’re telling you they have a great product, it’s incumbent on you to make the connection because you don’t want to deny your contact something good, it’s just plain ludicrous, just plain ludicrous. I mean, I think people who think that that’s effective networking are clueless as to what networking is really about.

Priscilla:
Yeah.

Ivan:
But I don’t have much energy on this, Priscilla. You notice that? Should I tell you how I really feel here?!

Priscilla:
Yeah, tell me how you really feel, Ivan.

Ivan:
Yeah, I got really frustrated with this one. And again, I think it’s probably because I really believe that most BNI members really get this, they understand it, and they know it’s all about relationships. So even to this day, I still get blindsided by people who not only don’t get it, but even when you’ve explained it don’t get it. There’s a lot of people who have come to me and did a premature solicitation, they were asking for a referral, and I tell them, “Look, I’m all about doing business with people I know and trust.” And I explain it to them. I would say the overwhelming majority of people, especially BNI members, go, “I get it; I understand. That makes sense to me.”

But boy, I’m telling you, this is only part of the dialogue that I had with this guy. This is one little piece of a very long series of e-mails back and forth, and he was absolutely convinced that there was not only nothing wrong with this, but that’s what everybody should be doing. So, I just basically said, “Good luck with that. Let me know how that works out for you.”

Priscilla:
This must be a very high pressured sales technique, isn’t it?

Ivan:
Yeah, it is a high pressure sales technique, and I understand that, but I think sales to some extent are changing, and more and more, it’s about the relationships that you’ve got with people and not just about closing deals. You even look at the kind of literature that’s written about sales today. It’s a lot different than 25 years ago. A lot of the stuff that was being done 25 years ago was simply technique oriented. “If you get an objection, here’s how you respond to an objection. It’s all about closing the deal.”

But even in sales, the best sales guys today are training on how to serve the customer and how to build a long-term relationship, how to maintain touchpoints. We talked to Rick Itzkowich recently in one of the podcasts about touchpoints nd staying in touch with people. That’s the first part of the visibility. The long-term touchpoint staying in touch with people kind of thing is about building relationships. You’ve got to do that, and I think the literature has really changed, even in sales. I think people that are still teaching that are old school.

Priscilla:
Yeah, I think you’re right.

Ivan:
Well, listen, Priscilla, thank you very much. Thanks for letting me rant. It’s been fun.

Priscilla:
You’re totally welcome!

All right. Well, I think that’s it for this week. I’d just like to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by AskIvanMisner.com. Thanks so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and we hope you’ll join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

Dr. Misner just finished surveying 12,000 business people from every populated continent. He asked which of these four things was most important when making a referral:

1. Knowing a person’s character
2. Knowing a person’s level of competency
3. Using the person’s product or service myself
4. Knowing a person’s success

Not surprisingly, knowing a person’s character number one. What did surprise Dr. Misner was that neither using a person’s product or service yourself nor knowing a person’s level of success mattered very much.

This means that many of your referrals will come from people who have not actually used your products or services—if they have reason to believe in your character and competency.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 145 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables.

I’m Priscilla Rice, and I’m coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, California, and I’m joined on the phone today by the founder and the chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner.

Hello, Ivan. How are you, and what do you have for us today?

Ivan:
I am doing great, and today I want to talk about a survey that I’ve completed. It’s actually part of a survey for a new book I’m working on about gender, the difference between men and women and how they network. But we have a lot of basic questions about business networking that we ask, and so I’m starting to compile some of the data. So I just finished this survey of more than 12,000 business people from every populated continent of the world. And one of the questions we asked the respondents was, “Which of the following is more important to you when referring business to others? Which of the following is more important to you when referring business to others?” We gave them four choices. One, knowing a person’s character; two, knowing a person’s level of competency; three, using the person’s product or service myself; and four, knowing a person’s success. So those are the four things that we asking them to pick from, which one was most important.

Now, not surprisingly, knowing a person’s character ranked number one in the survey, and I wasn’t surprised by that. But interestingly, using the product or service myself ranked third out of the four choices. So knowing a person’s character was number one, knowing a person’s level of competency was number two, using a product or service themself was number three, and knowing a person’s level of success was a very distant fourth.

But I was a little surprised about using the product or service myself ranking so low, because it was kind of a distant third. And if the listeners are interested in seeing a graph of this, they can go to my blog, NetworkingNowBlog.com, NetworkingNowBlog, com and take a look at the February 4th article there, and you’ll see this graph that’s there. It think it’s important to know that when people are referring you, that knowing your level of character is important, but having actually used your products or services turns out not to be as important as I would have thought. Often, we think that the best source of referrals must be our clients, our customers, our patients, and although they’re definitely a good source, they’re not always our only source. In fact, based on this survey, personally using and experiencing another person’s products or services before referring that business to the person was not nearly as important as their character and their competency. And this really is valuable in BNI.

Now, granted, we recommend you use a BNI member before you refer them, but based on this, you don’t necessarily have to use them before you refer them. This is why testimonials and endorsements in the chapter are so important, because if you hear somebody say over and over and over again, “I’ve used this person. I’ve used this person,” then you start to be comfortable with their products or service. What this basically means is that you need to build your credibility with people who know you. Whether they’ve used your business or not, if people trust your character and competency, they are likely to refer you regardless of whether they’ve actually used your products or services.

This is an important paradigm shift. For a lot of people, it means that many of your referrals may actually come from people other than your clients. If you learn how to network effectively, particularly in groups like BNI, you can use this to your benefit.

That’s all I’ve got for today, Priscilla. Any questions before we close up?

Priscilla:
Well, I just want to say that I think you hit upon with the testimonials is what would make somebody feel comfortable referring someone they haven’t used, and that’s why I think it’s so important in the meeting.

Ivan:
Yeah, the testimonial portion of a BNI meeting is really critical, and I think that the testimonials are what helps build your character and your competency. When somebody stands up and says, “Wow, they did what they said they would do, they did a good job,” then that applies to somebody’s character and competency, and I’d be willing to refer someone, even if I hadn’t used them, if I’ve heard many people say, “They did a great job. They charged what they said they would charge.” I feel comfortable referring them, and I think that’s one of the reasons why BNI works as well as it does, is that it’s not required that you use the members, although it is recommended.

Don’t get me wrong, I won’t understate that. It is recommended; it’s not required. You can absolutely refer people that you haven’t actually done business with yet, and most of that happens because of the credibility that’s built during the testimonial portion of the meetings. That’s why the testimonial portion is so important.

Priscilla:
Yeah, I totally agree. Okay, Ivan, well, that’s great! Thank you so much.

Ivan:
Thank you.

Priscilla:
I would just like to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables. Thanks so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and we hope you’ll join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

A chauffeur told Dr. Misner a story about a mine owner explained that it would take 11 years before his next mining operation would produce any revenue. Networking and referral networking can also take time to pay off.

When you’re digging a mine, part of the challenge is getting down through hundreds of feet of solid rock. In referral marketing, you have to deal with the time confidence curve. For some professions, the time it takes for a prospect to develop confidence in you may be very short; for others, it may be many months.

Your prospects will never develop confidence if you don’t keep participating in the activities that bring you business. Dr. Misner’s new book, Networking Like a Pro, includes a scorecard that measures these activities so you can track your success.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 141 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables.

I’m Priscilla Rice, and I’m coming to you from the beautiful Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, California, and I am joined on the phone today by the founder and the chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner.

Hello, Ivan. What do you have to share with us today?

Ivan:
Today I have an interesting topic, I think, called Referral Mining, and the idea came for it last year when I met a chauffeur in Arizona who drove me from the airport to a speaking engagement that I was scheduled to do. We talked about referral marketing and business in general, and he shared with me that he had a client that runs a mining operation. I thought that was little unusual to jump from referral marketing to mining, but he said that the client told him that his next big mining project was going to take 11 years before it started to bring in any revenue at all.

Priscilla:
Wow!

Ivan:
And the client explained to the driver that the mining operation is spending the first 11 years of the project but doing nothing but digging down to find a vein that it believed was there and that that would allow the company to start getting revenue from the project but that that mining operation, before it hit the vein, would take at least 11 years before any money whatsoever started to come in.

What I thought was really interesting is that the chauffeur said to me that “I imagine that digging a mine is a little like referral marketing. You have to give it time.

And I thought, “Wow, no truer words have ever been spoken about network referral marketing.”

And not only did the chauffeur immediately pick up on what sometimes takes really good networkers months or years to figure out, he put it in simple terms with on powerfully impressive analogy. Now, clearly, we don’t want people to have to wait 11 years in the networking process, but the driver really hit the nail on the head when he said that you have to give it time. And when it comes to networking, the simple truth is that it can take many, many months. It can take sometimes, depending on the profession you’re in, it can take a year before the referral mining and the relationship building you’re doing starts to yield any results.

So thanks to the driver who shared with me his mining story and his remarkably insightful comment about referral marketing, I think this is something that would make a great dialog for education coordinators with the chapter, because one of the things members need to remember is that different professions may take different lengths of time. One of the articles in Masters of Networking and in my latest book, which just came out this year, Networking Like a Pro, talks about the time confidence curve and how, no matter what profession you’re in, it’s going to take a certain amount of time before people have confidence in your ability to provide a quality product and service. Florists, the time confidence curve may be very short, but a financial planner, it can be off the chart, it can take many, many, many months. And that’s what we’re talking about with Referral Mining, that, depending on your profession, it’s going to take time before you build the relationship.

I just love that analogy, and I thought I would share it, and I hope that chapters all around the world share that with members.

Priscilla:
Yeah, that’s good information. I think the hardest thing is to keep the member satisfied and happy and in the chapter for the amount of time that it might take for him or her to develop the relationships that are necessary.

Ivan:
Right. But, you know, it can be done. You have to remember that you just have to keep doing the activities necessary to generate the business. And many years ago when I was a consultant, I worked with insurance companies teaching them how to cold call. I got to be pretty good teaching them how to cold call. I did it long enough to know that I never wanted to do it again for the rest of my life. And it was interesting, because you kept track of the activities that you were supposed to be doing to get the appointments, and it was basically making those cold calls. And you knew that if you made 100 cold calls, you’re going to probably be able to talk to 10 people, and if you talk to 10, you’re going to get one appointment. And you needed about five to ten appointments to make a sale. So that means you needed to make hundreds of phone calls to make that happen. And so they were really good, most of these insurance companies that I worked with in consulting for them, were very good at keeping track and having a cold call scorecard.

Well, one of the things we did in networking like a pro is that we put in a scorecard of the activities that you should be doing in order to track the amount of business that you can getting.

Priscilla:
So what’s in the networking scorecard, Ivan?

Ivan:
Well, the networking scorecard is a way of measuring the kinds of things that you should be doing in the same way that insurance companies measured cold calls and the number of times you called and the numbers of times you got through to people. It was a way of tracking success. In the networking scorecard, you track the kind of things that you need to be doing in order to achieve success in networking, and those kinds of things include sending a thank you card, calling someone in your networking and having a conversation, arranging a one-to-one meeting, attending a networking event, setting up some kind of activity to connect with people, giving a referral, sending an article of interest. I mean, there’s just a whole lot of things that you can do to track your networking scorecard, and that is part of the Referral Mining.

So if you are doing things that are listed in the networking scorecard in the book Networking Like a Pro, then you’re mining your network. And you know that although it may take time, you’re doing the things necessary to generate the business, and that kind of activity will make you feel a little more comfortable, because you know results are on their way, because you’re doing the things that you know will lead you to generating business in the same way that, when people do cold calls and they make those cold calls, they know that they have to do a certain number in order to get business. With the networking scorecard, you know you have to do a certain number of these things in order to get business. Same thing; it works the same way, and it’s a way to track it and feel better about the activities that you’re conducting.

Priscilla:
That’s great! And that’s all in the book, right?

Ivan:
Yeah, it’s all in the end of the book, Networking Like a Pro, which just came out last month.

Priscilla:
Well, that sounds good. I have that book, and I’m looking forward to reading it. Thank you, Ivan.

Ivan:
Thank you very much, Priscilla.

Priscilla:
Okay, well, I think that’s the end of this podcast, and I’d like to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables. Thanks so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and we hope you’ll join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

Today Dr. Misner is joined by BNI Hall of Fame Director Dawn Lyons from Northern California. Dawn trains people how to be proactive rather than reactive about making referrals.

Here’s the technique:

• Toward the end of a meeting with a new client, tell them that you’re part of a referral network that allows you to offer additional services.
• Then offer them your card file and walk away.
• When you come back, ask whether the client needs the services of any of these people.
• If they do, provide specific recommendations for that persons.

To make this work, you have to know your fellow BNI members and their work well.

Card File Challenge

Run a contest in your chapter to see who can do “The Card File Thingy” the most in a month, and what results you get. Leave a comment here on the blog to let us know what you think of the idea and how your chapter’s Card File Challenge turned out.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 135 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables.

I’m Priscilla Rice, and I’m coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, California, and I am joined on the phone today by the founder and the chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner.

Hello, Ivan. How are you?

Ivan:
Hi, Priscilla. I’m doing great. It was really nice meeting you at our International Directors Conference last month. We’ve done these podcasts all these many months now, a year-and-a-half, and it was a pleasure to finally meet you.

Priscilla:
I know. I just enjoyed it so much; it was just great! Thank you for inviting me.

Ivan:
Yeah. Listen, talking about directors, I have with us today an executive director who’s going to be doing this podcast with me. Her name is Dawn Lyons. She is a BNI executive director up in Northern California, and she’s been an executive director since 2000. She’s also a partner in the Referral Institute, and I think most notably, she’s a Hall of Fame director for BNI, having opened up a large number of chapters in one year, 20 chapters in one year. And she’s one of only five or six directors in the world who’ve ever done that, the only woman who has done it, so I’m really pleased to have on the podcast with us Dawn Lyon.

Hi, Dawn.

Dawn:
Hi, Ivan. Hi, Priscilla. How are you?

Priscilla:
Very good, thank you.

Ivan:
You’re on the podcast today to talk about the card file thingy that BNI has and really how to use the BNI card file, and you train your members to do referrals proactively instead of reactively. And I thought maybe this would be great material for our BNI members, so let me turn it over to you.

Dawn:
Okay. One of the things that we see a lot is that people actually are in a reactive mode when they’re trying to generate a referral. Someone will literally say, “Gosh, I’m having problems with my Web site. Do you know a Web site designer?” And they will literally ask you and, therefore, now, all of a sudden, you’re excited because you have a referral.

Well, what we want to train people on is how to do referrals proactively, literally being out there working on our chapter members’ behalf so that we can generate more referrals for the entire chapter. And Priscilla knows this because we actually train this in our region. Our members all across the world have the tool that they can be using more effectively.

We haven’t come up with a very fancy name, so we do call it The Card File Thingy because it’s just this approach that if we use this approach, we had one gentleman, whose name is Brian Johnson, he got seven referrals from one person in about five to eight minutes.

Priscilla:
Wow!

Ivan:
That’s amazing!

Dawn:
Yeah, just using this technique. So if I can, I’ll just kind of role play it a little bit and have people understand a little script that we utilize, because the script is actually very, very crucial to the success of the outcome of using The Card File Thingy. So we all have our burgundy card file holders, we all have our members’ cards in there, but if we carry it around with us and we use it at our appointments, this is when it become proactive referral marketing.

So let’s say that I am in Web site development and I’m working with one of my clients or I’m on a customer service call, I may be out and about, I may be meeting with friends or even working with co-workers, but if I say something to a client that’s really specific, this is the script that we find, used well, works incredibly well.

I do my appointments, and towards the end of the appointment, I’m going to say something to the effect of, “You know, I don’t know if you know this or not, but as an added service to all of my clients, I actually belong to a referral organization which allows me to help you with more than just your Web site needs. I happen to know 35 or more local business people that I know, like, and trust would do a great job for you if you ever needed any of their services. So I’ll tell you what, I have some paperwork that I need to go grab. Why don’t you look through here, and I’ll be right back.”

Well, what do you think happens as soon as you walk away?

Ivan:
They always open up the card file.

Dawn:
Yeah, they’re always going to open up the card file. And here I am sitting there asking them questions about their Web site needs, I have no idea if they want to get their carpets cleaned or if they’ve been thinking about doing some landscaping or they want to get some new blinds in their home. I don’t ask questions about that type of stuff, but I definitely have members in my chapter that are looking for those kinds of client referrals. And so the key is, and there’s a couple secrets to this technique, you absolutely have to walk away from the person that has the card file in their hands. Could you imagine if you were standing over their shoulder watching them?

Ivan:
Yeah. No, that doesn’t work. But what are they going to do? Open it up.

Dawn:
Yeah, you just want them to open it up and then they flip through it and they know what services they might be needing in the next couple of months.

When you come back, there’s another key step. So when you come back, you simply say something like, “So, gosh, do you or your family need any of the services of all these folks that I know?” They’re either going to say yes or no, and either one is okay. And the reason for that is, as a business person, you just made yourself more likeable and more appropriate to them as far as them wanting to come back to you later, because you have shown them that you know these 35-plus local business people.

So if they say, “Yes, you know, gosh, I didn’t know that you knew someone who was in financial advising, or “Gosh, we were looking for a new chiropractor.”

The key here is you’ve got to be able to promote your member really, really well. You can’t just say, “Oh, you should go see Joe because he’s a really nice guy.” You need more information than that. For instance, if someone came back to my card holder and said, “Well, I was really looking at this CPA; we’re not real happy with our CPA,” I would want to be able to say, “My CPA, Tim, has literally saved two of my dear friends; one of them $1200 and the other one over $6,000, and he only looked at their tax returns for less than ten minutes.”

Ivan:
Wow, that’s amazing! And this is similar conceptually to what I’ve talked about in a previous podcast as being a gatekeeper, that you want to be in a position where you’re referring people, particularly to your clients and customers and associates because it builds your credibility with them as well as enabling you to pass referrals.

Dawn:
Yeah, absolutely. And I think the real key is compelling the person to want to take the members’ phone call, and just letting them know that they’re a nice guy or they have a great personality is kind of like the blind date. If they have a great personality, what do you normally think of?

Priscilla:
They don’t look good.

Ivan:
I don’t want to say!

Dawn:
So here, you really want some really good information, so always have a couple of your BNI members’ best stories, how have they helped someone. Because now the person is looking for those services, you tell a great story about your member and say, “Is this the kind of expert you’d like to talk with? I can get you that personal introduction.”

Priscilla:
Right.

Ivan:
That’s great. What kind of results? You mentioned one, but can you give us a couple of other examples of results people have had using this technique.

Dawn:
Yeah, absolutely. My first ever experience with this was probably four or so years ago. I had a gal come up to me at a Members Success Program, and she said, “You know what? This is my second time through Members Success, and the reason why is because I am the lowest referral giver in the chapter, and I want to do something about it.” We showed her this technique. It was kind of off to the side, it wasn’t even in the big presentation, and she e-mailed me the following weeks and said, “By the way, just be using that technique, I generated 11 referrals for my chapter members this week.”

Ivan:
Wow!

Dawn:
In one week’s time, just by doing The Card File Thingy, walking away from her clients or anyone that she had that appointment with, letting them look through the book and see what services they needed, she was able to do that.

I also just had a gal by the name of Mylie Colmer, who is a Realtor, she showed the book 29 times and got 16 referrals.

Ivan:
Wow, that’s amazing! It’s amazing how simple techniques like this can really make a difference. I tell people all the time, a lot of what we talk about is simple but not easy. If it were easy, everyone would do it. And the hard part about this is remembering to do it consistently. And if you do it consistently, it’s a simple idea that can make you one of the top referral givers in the chapter, can’t it?

Dawn:
Um-hmm, absolutely.

Priscilla:
I have a question.

Ivan:
Sure, go ahead, Priscilla.

Priscilla:
In my chapter, we have a brochure that’s written, it’s a handout really, with everybody’s name and information and Web sites on it, telephone numbers. Do you think it’s as effective to give them the brochure as it is to show them the card file?

Dawn:
Personally, I don’t, and here’s why. Even though the cards have all of the person’s information on it, I think the brochure is almost a way that they could just contact the person alone. And what we always want to do in referrals is make the connection.

Priscilla:
Um-hmm, right.

Dawn:
We want to make sure that the BNI member has the availability and the expectation that they can make that phone call and talk to that prospect.

Ivan:
You know, I agree. I certainly don’t think it’s a bad idea to have some kind of flyer with the different businesses on it, but to be honest with you, nothing beats the person’s business card. I think it’s more effective, and that card file is a great way to get people to do that. I saw it done many, many years ago with somebody who would take orders. He would be filling out the paperwork, and he would hand the file to them. Now, he didn’t leave the room, but he was busy filling out paperwork. His head was down and he’s writing stuff out while the person was going through it, and it was a effective way to generate referrals. That was the first time I ever saw.

Well, we’re just about out of time, Dawn. I think you’ve got an assignment for everyone, don’t you?

Dawn:
Well, you know, we were thinking that it would be kind of fun to have people in the chapters actually create a challenge around this. Who could just do The Card File Thingy approach however many times in maybe a month? And so if all the chapters want to get on board with this and really proactively market their chapter members, this would be the easiest way to create a habit. It makes them look good, and they’re offering an additional service to their clients to really be that contact person that can connect them with anyone they need to in the community.

So my challenge is why not run a challenge in the chapter and see who can do The Card File Thingy the most amount of times in a month!

Ivan:
I love it! So there’s the challenge. Everyone listening to this podcast, take it back to your chapter, explain the program, and let’s see what kind of results your chapter can get. And by all means, leave a message here on this podcast where you can leave comments about what you think of the idea and how it worked out, if you did it.

Dawn, thank you so much. You’re a great director for BNI, and we appreciate your idea here today.

Back to you, Priscilla.

Priscilla:
Okay, great! Thank you, Dawn, and thank you, Ivan.

I think that’s it for this week. I just want to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables. Thank you so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and we hope you’ll join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

This week Dr. Misner wants to expose three common delusions about referrals and referral sources.

1. You should always get a referral when you’re in front of the referral source.
2. To maximize your chances of getting good referrals, it’s best to move from one networking group to another networking group at regular intervals.
3. Your best source of referrals is your customer.

Dr. Misner recommends creating a curriculum for your referral sources, breaking what you do down into 30-second or 60-second highly-focused sound bites that others in your BNI chapter or any other networking group can use to refer you to others.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 130 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast which is brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables.

I’m Priscilla Rice, and I’m coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, California, and I am joined on the phone today by the founder and the chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner.

Hello, Ivan. How are you?

Ivan:
Doing great, Priscilla, and I’ve got an interesting topic today, Three Common Delusions About Referral Sources.

Priscilla:
Great! Well, tell us all about it.

Ivan:
Here’s number 1, Delusion Number 1. You should always get a referral when you’re in front of the referral source. That’s one that you know seems counterintuitive. Many of these delusions kind of do. But the truth is, if your referral strategy requires you to be present in order to get a referral, you’re putting severe limits on your potential business. Referrals happen when you’re in front of the referral source only if your system is dependent on you asking for the referral and getting it at the same time. So what that means to BNI members is that it’s very important to remember that you are trying to train that referral team, not close a sale or not just get a referral as you’re standing in front of them, but teaching them how to go out and listen for referrals so that they can bring them back to you. You don’t need to be in front of your referral source every time you get a referral; it’s a delusion.

Priscilla:
Okay.

Ivan:
Delusion Number 2. To maximize your chances of getting good referrals, it’s best to move from one networking group to another networking group on regular intervals. This is what I call “scorched earth networking,” and it’s about as friendly as it sounds. And I think in BNI, a lot of people, they get that, they understand that it’s about the relationship building. But there’s still sometimes new people into BNI are coming in thinking, “Well, I’ll be in for six months or a year and get all of the business I can, and then I’ll try something else out; or I’ll do this or I’ll do that.” I see it in Chambers, where somebody will join a local Chamber and they’re in for a little while, and they work it for a year and they kind of move on to the next Chamber. I think I may have used this analogy a couple years ago on one of the podcasts, but it’s like planting a citrus tree, and you wait for a year, of course, you care for it and take really good care and fertilize it and water it. At the end of a year, how much fruit are you going to get out of the tree you plant, Priscilla?

Priscilla:
Not much. I have one, and it’s . . .

Ivan:
Yeah, and so it’s like you plant it, you care for it for year, you don’t get a whole lot, and you go, “Well, you know what? It’s not working so well here, so I’m going to rip it up from the roots, and I’m going to plant it over there instead, because if it didn’t grow well here or give me much fruit here, it’s bound to grow more fruit over there.” And then you replant it someplace else, and you let it sit there for a year, you take good care of it, but how much fruit are you going to get that second year?

Priscilla:
Right. None.

Ivan:
Not much. And so you look at it and say, “Well, it’s not working there. I’m going to rip it up from the roots, and I’ll go plant it someplace else.” Now, that sounds ridiculous, but that’s exactly what people do in networking groups. It’s exactly what they do. They join a networking group. They’re in for six months or a year. They plant the seeds. They start to build these roots of relationships. They don’t come to full fruition yet, because it’s all based on trust and relationship building. And they go, “Well, you know, I’ve been in here for a little while. I’m going to rip this up from the roots, and I’m going to go plant my network someplace else and see if I get more business.”

It’s a bad idea to move around unless you’ve got some serious issues in that networking group. You want to stay and build the relationships, whether you’re talking about a Chamber or a BNI group or a service club or other networks. Don’t practice “scorched earth networking.”

Priscilla:
Great.

Ivan:
Delusion Number 3. Your best source of referrals is your customer. And it’s a delusion. The reason people sometimes fall into this delusion is that they’ve been trained to believe it and they’ve never really pursued any other source of referrals. And the only referrals they’ve ever received are from customers.

Now, in BNI, I think, to a large extent, we get that, that your customers are not necessarily the best source of referrals. Now, don’t get me wrong; I’m not saying they’re not a good source of referrals, but they may not be the best source of referrals. And that’s one of the reasons why I created BNI, because I knew my customers were a great source of referrals, but I also knew that many other businesses, that if I could develop a relationship with them, would be a great source of referrals. Because you can create this sort of symbiosis with them, where you’re referring to them and they’re referring to you. And I found personally that although my customers are a good source of referrals, they were not the best source of referrals if I worked with other businesses that were compatible to mine that I could develop a relationship with and generate business with.

And so these are the three common delusions about referral sources. You should always get a referral when you’re in front of the referral source to maximize your chances of getting referrals; move from one networking group to another on regular intervals; and your best source of referrals is your customers. Those are the three delusions that I have for today.

Priscilla:
That’s great. I have a question for you, Ivan, and it’s a little bit off topic, but not completely. When you’re in your BNI chapter and you’re giving your 30 second infomercial and you want to stimulate referrals, what can you do in 30 seconds? It just seems so incredibly short, and I’m wondering if you can help us.

Ivan:
Well, you’re in a big group, Priscilla, and you’re doing 30 seconds, but most of the chapters are doing a minute, so that’s pretty much the norm in most groups. But I think the question still applies, what can you do in a minute? You’ve got to be laser specific about what you do. The more laser specific you are, the better. What tends to happen is really two things.

One is, in the chapters that are not as successful, members, on average, just wing it on their 60 second presentation. So they’re not prepared in any way whatsoever. Or they’re preparing their 60 second presentation while the guy next to him is giving their 60 second presentation.

Priscilla:
Right.

Ivan:
You’ve never seen that, I’m sure, right?! So that’s the first mistake, not preparing. Give some thought to what you’re going to say in advance. As a matter of fact, I recommend that you create a curriculum, sit down and. either for the next year or at least for the next two months, create your curriculum, your Product 101. And be laser specific, and each week talk about something else, break it down. You’ve hear me talk about this in a lot of my books, the LCD, the least, or lowest, common denominator. Another way of looking at it is it’s a laser shot rather than a shotgun. Rather than say I’m a full service whatever, I can do anything you want, you talk about one little aspect of what you do. And the reason for that is, that gives people something to remember. They remember a specific product or service that you have. And if you do that every week with different products, different services, different benefits of the various products or services, your qualifications as a business person, and you do all those little bite size pieces over the course of year, you’ve given almost an hour’s worth of content.

In big chapters like yours, maybe not quite an hour’s worth, but you’ve given many, many, many minutes worth of content about what you do that’s so specific that’s it’s hard for people to forget about elements of your products or services. That’s what I would recommend.

Priscilla:
Okay. And even in a 30 second?

Ivan:
Yeah, especially in a 30 second, you need to be prepared more than anything else, because there’s no time to wing it and expect any kind of results. But again, the overwhelming majority of chapters worldwide do 60 second presentations.

Priscilla:
Okay.

Ivan:
But when you get really big, that’s a good problem. When you have lots of members, you’ve got to cut something back, and sometimes that’s one of the things that gets cut back. But then you end of passing a lot of referrals within the group, especially if you’re doing one-to-ones like we talked about with Dr. Goulston and in other podcasts that I’ve done. You do those kinds of things and big chapters can not only be better, but generally are better because of those – they became big because they’re doing so many things right. Does that make sense?

Priscilla:
Yeah, it does. Okay, great. Well, thank you for sharing that with us.

Ivan:
Thanks, Priscilla.

Priscilla:
Well, I think that’s it for this week. Thank you so much, Dr. Misner.

This podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables. Thank you so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and we hope you’ll join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

This is a follow-up to last week’s episode about asking for testimonials. There are three keys to using written testimonials successfully.

1. Ask for written testimonials at every opportunity—but not too soon!
2. Guide the content of your testimonials. The easier you make it for your client, the more likely you are to get what you need.
3. Update your testimonials. Review your file or binder (or website) every two to three years at least. Discard anything from a company that’s no longer in business. Feel free to ask ongoing clients to update their testimonials if it’s appropriate.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 111 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables.

I’m Priscilla Rice, and I’m coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, California, and I am joined on the phone today by the founder and the chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner.

Hello, Ivan. How are you?

Ivan:
I’m doing great, Priscilla. Thank you.

Priscilla:
Great. So what are you going to share with us today?

Ivan:
Well, today I’m going to talk about three keys to using testimonials, which is follow-up to last week’s podcast on Asking for Written Testimonials. And the question really is: How to you use those testimonials when you have them? So that’s what I want to talk about today.

We know what a powerful tool testimonials can be when it comes to building credibility and generating new business. I talk about that in last week’s podcast, but it’s also very important to know how to successfully use testimonials and how to ask for them. And there are three keys to successfully using written testimonials that I would like to talk about today.

One is that you ask for testimonials at every opportunity. Whenever you have the chance, I think it’s really important to ask for those testimonials.

Second is to guide the content of your testimonials. Don’t necessarily write them, but guide the content, help to coach and guide the direction that the testimonials go.

And three is to update your testimonials.

So at what point in the sales cycle should you ask clients or your fellow members of BNI or other contacts for testimonials? This is kind of a tricky question, but in general, ask for no testimonial before it’s time. You want to make sure that you are at credibility with somebody before you’re asking for an endorsement or a testimonial. Now, this is probably before or after the completion of a sale or a project, but depending on the type of client that you have, your product, or service, it’s after you’ve established a good relationship that you’re going to want to ask for that endorsement or for that testimonial.

So let’s say, for argument’s sake, that that’s one month before a finishing major with some client or after the completion of the project. You want to call your client to ask how things are going before it’s over. If the client tells you that they’re really happy with the results and that their business is better because of the products or services, that’s the point that your testimonial detector should be pinging loudly; it’s the right time to make your pitch; it’s the right time to start to talk to the client about the endorsement. It would be good to say to them, “It would be a great thing for other people to know about what I do. Would you be willing, when I’m completed with the project, to do an endorsement or testimonial on your company letterhead by the end of the project?” If they’re happy, they’re going to absolutely say yes, they’d be more than glad to do that.

The next step is to then coach the client in writing the testimonial that fits your needs. Ask him or her to tell why they chose you to do the work and how they benefited from your products or services, how you solved the problem for them, what other people should know about your business, what are most people concerned about using a business like yours. Ask them to address those issues. Don’t be afraid to offer suggestions. That’s really important. Don’t be afraid to offer suggestions. It will make it easier for them to write an appropriate testimonial, and the results will be more valuable for you. Sometimes people feel uncomfortable laying the ground work and doing a portion of the testimonial, but I’m here to tell you that for people, it’s really easier if you can give them some suggestions or show them some previous endorsements that have been done or give them some verbiage to use.

For example, I’m asked to do dozens and dozens and dozens of book endorsements every year. I mean, literally, I think last year was like 30 or 40 book endorsements and forwards that I was asked to write. It’s so much easier when somebody comes to me and says, “Here’s my book; here’s my material. Here is a sample endorsement or two or three.” And they’ll give me two or three to pick from, and they’ll say – these are the people that are really doing it right – “Here are two or three; these are covering some topics or some comments other endorsements I have are kind of missing. So if you feel comfortable with two or three of those, would you use them as is or put them in your own words or come up with something on your own.” So they’re basically saying to me, “Look, you don’t have to use my words, but here’s something to start you off with.”

Do you have any idea how helpful that is for somebody who’s very busy?

Priscilla:
Yeah.

Ivan:
And they’re going to pick and I pick and endorsement of phraseology that fits my style, that fits something I would say, and then I adjust it or change it or I may rewrite it completely or rewrite it in part. It gives me a starting point.

And so there’s nothing wrong with coaching and guiding the endorsement. Just ask the person to be honest and tell them that if none of these work, come up with something else that they feel more comfortable with. There’s nothing wrong with that at all.

Priscilla:
Do you think it’s embarrassing for the person that’s presenting it to write something about themselves and then hand it to you? Do you think that’s awkward?

Ivan:
Yeah. Yeah, it is, especially if you’ve not done it much. It feels uncomfortable; it feels like it could be self-serving, and so that’s why you want to have a lot of escape clauses in what you say to them.

Priscilla:
I see, yeah.

Ivan:“If you don’t like this or this doesn’t fit exactly how you feel, please, please feel free to write something completely different or write what you feel comfortable with.” There’s nothing wrong with that. But the bottom like is you want the endorsement, you want the testimonial, and people are very, very, very busy; especially successful people. And so the easier you can make it for them, the more likely they’re going to give you what you need. You have to remember, this is for you, not for your client. You’re asking for your client to do something for you. And they’re generally more than willing, but they may be busy, so the easier you can make it for them, the better.

Priscilla:
Yeah.

Ivan:
Now, here’s the last part of the process, and that is to update your endorsements and testimonials. You want to review your testimonial file or binder at least every two to three years, at least, to identify testimonials that are no longer valid or credible, out of date. Specifically, you want to discard refile a testimonial that’s from a company that’s no longer in business. That’s important.

Priscilla:
It’s so funny.

Ivan:
You have a big company and maybe they were well known and you got an endorsement, but they’re out of business now, that doesn’t necessarily make you look good. An endorsement from the vice president of Enron isn’t going to help you at all.

Priscilla:
Exactly.

Ivan:
So it’s not what you want.

For those of our listeners who are from other countries, Enron was a big company that went out of business a couple of years ago.

Priscilla:
It might hurt you.

Ivan:
Yeah, exactly. So you want to pull those out.

Was it written by somebody who has left the company? That may or may not be as big of a deal. Just because they left the company doesn’t mean you pull it out of your file. It may still be completely valid, but it’s certainly one you want to think about.

Does it represent a product or service that you no longer offer? Well, you certainly don’t want that to be an endorsement letter if it’s something you don’t do anymore.

Is the endorsement dated in some way? Does it talk about something that was only relevant at one point, the situation or the experience? Does it need to be updated with new statistics from the customer? Now, that’s important. What if this is a customer that you’ve been working with over time and you’ve got more current data, and you want to get that updated? That’s really easy. You go back to the customer, you say, “Here’s the endorsement you did earlier. Would you mind just plugging in these numbers instead of that? And would you sign off on it?” And generally speaking, they’d be more than glad to do that. So these are things that you want to remember.

So just to review, you want to ask for testimonials at every opportunity; you want to guide the content of your testimonials; and you want to update your testimonials over time.

One more thing.

Priscilla:
What’s that?

Ivan:
Remember the law of reciprocity; it works here, too. If want to motivate someone to write you a testimonial, write one for him or her first. Offer to do an endorsement for them whenever you’re doing business with somebody who’s also doing business with you. And I think that these are recommendations that are really powerful and valuable for BNI members all around the world.

Priscilla:
That’s great, Ivan. I just want to mention that our BNI group is going to talk about the possibility of writing testimonials for each other inside of the meeting instead of a presentation, and we’re going to talk about it at our leadership meeting this week. And I’ll let you know how that goes.

Ivan:
Yeah, that’s a great idea, and those kinds of discussions, I think, can be really valuable for a chapter. It’s very focused on the vision of the organization and the purpose of the organization, which is to support one another. And I think it’s a great idea to spend ten minutes at a meeting talking about how do we do good written testimonials.

By the way, I’ve seen many chapters that literally have a chapter testimonial binder where members have endorsed other members and the work that the other members have done. And they have that for visitors who come to visit the group, and I think that’s a great idea.

Priscilla:
Yeah, that’s a great idea. I hadn’t thought of that.

Okay, well, I think we might be out of time.

Ivan:
Yes, thanks, Priscilla. Great interview today.

Priscilla:
Well, thank you, Dr. Misner.

I think that’s it for this week. I just want to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables. Thanks so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and I hope you’ll join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.

Phenomenal reviews can convince you to go to an out-of-the-way restaurant. Written testimonials can do the same thing for your business. Consumers trust testimonials from other people more than they do your own marketing materials.

BNI members can use written testimonials in several ways.

• Place written testimonials on your website.
• If your business attracts walk-in clients, display your written testimonials in a binder in your reception area. If you’re a salesperson, take a binder with testimonials with you when you call on prospects.
• Include testimonials and endorsements with your business proposals. Match the testimonial to the service you’re providing or the industry your prospect is in.

Using testimonials builds your credibility. Start by getting members of your BNI chapter to write testimonials for you. One place people can write testimonials for you is on Yelp.com.

Brought to you by Networking Now.

Complete Transcription of BNI Podcast Episode 110 -

Priscilla:
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Official BNI Podcast brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, which is the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables.

I’m Priscilla Rice, and I’m coming to you from the beautiful Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkley, California, and I am joined on the phone today by the founder and the chairman of BNI, Dr. Ivan Misner.

Hello, Ivan. How are you, and where are you?

Ivan:
Well, I’m in your neck of the woods this week, Priscilla. I’m in the Bay Area for a big conference. I’m doing the key note presentation at a Referral Institute conference this week up in San Francisco Bay area.

Priscilla:
Well, welcome. I’m so glad you’re here.

Ivan:
This week I’m going to be talking about Asking for Written Testimonials. Endorsements and testimonials are very important in word-of-mouth. I was thinking about this last weekend when my wife and I were on a trip. And we wanted to go out to a really nice restaurant, but we weren’t really sure what was there. We weren’t familiar with the town we were in, and Beth perused the local magazine for restaurant reviews, and I logged on to the Internet to search for some top rated restaurants in the area. And we settled on a steak house that was more than a little bit out of the way and not real easy to get to. People might say, “Why? Why would you do that?” Well, it’s because the restaurant had phenomenal reviews both online and in the local magazine, and that was really enough to convince us that we should go there and try it out.

It’s like that, I think, in business. Before people come to you for a particular product or service, they often want the comfort of knowing what others have said about you. Testimonials carry a level of credibility because they come from someone who has direct experience with your product or your service. Consumers generally place more trust in a testimonial from another person than in the business’ own marketing message. That’s very true. They’re a little less likely to believe the marketing or sales than they would that testimonial or endorsement. They believe that the average person is unbiased, particularly if we’re talking to a friend.

And that’s why I think BNI works so well. It’s about people who know people, and they’re referring someone to someone they already know. So there’s a little bit of a relationship there. The person has nothing to gain from providing that endorsement.

Priscilla:
Right.

Ivan:
And the business really stands nothing to gain or lose, although, frankly, you do have something to lose if you give a bad endorsement or bad testimonial. You lose a little bit of your reputation. So people that trust others will take that endorsement, and I think that’s what so powerful about BNI.

So I wanted to talk about what you could do as a BNI member, and I think that written testimonials can be used in many ways to enhance your credibility, set you above your competition, and be used very effectively in BNI. And I have three suggestions.

One is, place endorsements or testimonials on your business Web site. Some Web sites have them strategically sprinkled throughout so there’s at least one testimonial on each page. Others have a dedicated page where a browser can view several endorsements or testimonials at once. That’s the first one, place some on your Web site.

Second is, if your business attracts a lot of walk-in clients, it’s helpful to display your written testimonials. Have them in a plastic sheath protector in a three-ring binder. Label them “What Our Customers Are Saying About Us,” or “Client Testimonials.” Keep the binder on a table in your reception area where customers can browse through it while they’re waiting for your services.

Priscilla:
That’s a good idea.

Ivan:
If you’re a sales person, you should have a binder that you take with you that has this content and information in it. It’s a good way to connect with your prospects and enhance your relationship with your current client.

The third thing is to use or include testimonials and endorsements with your business proposals. So if you have a proposal for business that you give out, a bid of any kind, include a handful of endorsements in a section of the bid or proposal, preferably one that’s specifically aimed at that individual. If you’re gathering many endorsements or testimonials and you can find some that somehow connect with this prospect, maybe it’s a similar industry or there was an endorsement or testimonial that addressed a similar issue, like quality of the product or customer service, and you do an endorsement, maybe that particular prospect is really concerned about your ability to deliver and provide good customer service, so you do some endorsements that apply to how good your customer service was. Make them specific to the prospect. That’s really, really powerful.

So if you make a standard practice to ask clients and contacts for testimonials, you’ll build your credibility and your business. What better place is there than BNI. Start, if you haven’t already, by getting members of BNI to do some of the endorsements for you, and use those in your proposals as you continue your business.

Priscilla:
We’ve done that quite a bit in our chapter. Are you familiar with the Web site by the name of Yelp.com?

Ivan:
Yes, I am. I am familiar with them. One of the senior executives just happened to contact me recently, and we will be getting sort of the beginning phases of relationship with Yelp in recommending Yelp. They are in most major cities in the United States. They have not gone international yet, but they are in most major cities. Yeah, I am familiar with them. Good program.

Priscilla:
Yeah, and that’s a perfect way to get testimonials up on your business and have them affect how many people contact you.

Ivan:
Well, I’m impressed with Yelp.com, and we may be doing some things with them as time goes on, and they certainly want to go international. We may be able to assist them with that. It’s ironic that you bring that up, because I literally just had a phone call with one of their executives just within the last few weeks.

Priscilla:
That’s great. Well, that’s wonderful. Do you have anything else you’d like to share before we end this podcast?

Ivan:
No, just to reiterate the three points that I gave. Place your endorsements on your Web site; have a binder; and use those endorsements in any proposals you give. You do those three things, start with BNI members and have it grow from there, and it’s a great way to help your prospects know about all the other people and what they think about your products and services. And that’s, I think, very important.

Thanks, Priscilla.

Priscilla:
Oh, you’re so welcome. Thank you, Dr. Misner.

I would just like to remind the listeners that this podcast has been brought to you by NetworkingNow.com, the leading site on the Net for networking downloadables. Thanks so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice, and we hope you’ll join us next week for another exciting episode of The Official BNI Podcast.